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Web of Gold
DR: What do you think Berenger Sauniere learned that made him terribly rich
and made him refuse Last Rites on his deathbed?
GP: The wealth of Abbe Sauniere has been grossly exaggerated. As I mention
in Web of Gold, it is most probable that he found the family heirlooms of
the Hautpouls, hidden by the Abbe Bigou in the church crypt prior to the
French Revolution. In addition, donations, dealing in various items, the
genuine sale of masses, and probable financial support for his Monarchist
stance from anonymous aristocrats would have been ample to fund his
activities and lifestyle. It is also possible that he did find some
documents which proved to be of value - but their contents have not been
publicly revealed and can only be the object of speculation. Concerning
Sauniere's last rites, the stories surrounding the extreme reaction of his
friend Abbe Riviere who attended him, are only hearsay. Sauniere may well
have been party to some great secret unacceptable to the Catholic Church,
but to date there is no actual proof. Although only speculation, I think
that it is possible that Sauniere's involvement with Martinism could have
brought him into contact with Spiritualism. Despite being a good Catholic
priest to his parishioners, a revelation of these esoteric activities may
have been unacceptable, even shocking, to another priest.
DR: Why do you suppose Sauniere went on walks in the middle of the night
collecting stones, and why did he construct a secret room in his sacristy?
GP: This is certainly one of the genuine mysteries of the Sauniere story,
though actual details of these events vary. His walks were during the day
when he would return with a knapsack full of rocks. He would then disappear
into the secret room accesible through a false bookcase from the sacristy.
It is of course possible that he had found something of value which he
wished to remain secret. His nocturnal activities are documented and refer
to clandestine diggings in the cemetery. I believe that he was looking for a
particular grave/tomb, that of Marie de Negre d'Hautpoul, that may have
contained precious artefacts or documents to supplement those he discovered
in the church.
DR: What's the meaning of the number 681 in the encoded parchments at Rennes
le Chateau? And what about the phrase, "This Horse of God"?
GP: There are at least 5 possible explanations of 681, one of which, found
in the Priory of Sion's secret dossier, concerns the arrival of the infant
Sigisbert IV at Rennes-le-Chateau, after the assassination of his father
Dagobert II, in 681. This account is refuted by all historians and
mainstream researchers who deny the existence of Sigisbert. However, another
persuasive explanation has recently come to light. The phrase PAX 681 may
refer to the founding of the nation of Bulgaria following a peace treaty in
681. This event is commemorated by an ancient rock carving in Bulgaria
entitled the HORSE OF GOD, a phrase also found in the Rennes parchments.
There are two specific links between Bulgaria and the Languedoc. Firstly,
the Cathar faith was closely connected to that of the Bulgarian Bogomils.
Secondly, the Celtic Tectosage tribe from Toulouse assisted their Bulgarian
cousins in the sack of Delphi in 273BC. Legend and history relate that the
Delphic treasure was brought back to the South of France where it
disappeared in the region of the Pyrenees.
DR: Do you believe there is anything to Boudet's claim that English is the
original Celtic language? Or did he just write Le Vraie Celtique et le
Cromlech de Rennes-le-Bains as a means of transmitting an encoded message?
GP: At the time of Boudet there was a proliferation of Celtic studies
throughout Europe that paralleled the great interest in Egyptology. Boudet
was evidently a very learned scholar but didn't have the advantage of the
mass of archaeological, anthropological and etymological research available
today. At the time of writing, Boudet's theory may have seemed a great deal
more credible than now and so we must accept the possibility that his book
is a genuine study. I am equally persuaded, however, that the book may well
contain coded information relating to secret locations probably within the
valley of Rennes-les-Bains. The key to this theory is the map of the valley
which undoubtedly contains some strange anomalies yet to be adequately
explained.
DR: How much credence do you give to the Priory of Sion's list of Grand
Masters?
GP: None. The list of Priory Grand Masters is a central part of Plantard's
Priory mythology. The Priory of Sion did not exist before 1956. The Ordre de
Notre Dame de Sion, with which the Priory of Sion is often confused, is a
totally separate organisation. Undoubtably, the individuals chosen for the
list indicate the mindset of those who fabricated the Priory mythology, and
are worthy of further study. The list is best studied not as a whole, but in
sections of 4 or5 characters and against the religious and political
backgrounds of their times.
DR: What was the agenda and purpose of the Order of Alpha Galates? Was it
similar to the Priory of Sion?
GP: An indication of the agenda and political ideology of Alpha Galates can
only be ascertained by reading the articles published in Vaincre, the
magazine edited by Pierre Plantard during the war. It appears to have strong
leanings towards the synarchist view, that of government by an elite
aristocracy with an emphasis on tradition and chivalry. This vision was
shared by the original 1956 Priory of Sion which grew out of the ideology of
Alpha Galates.
DR: Are the Priory of Sion connected to Grand Lodge Alpina and to P2
Freemasonry?
GP: The connections appear to be more by association rather than by direct
links. In other words they have at times shared the same objectives and
generally would be politically aligned.The result of my researches have led
me to believe that the Priory of Sion is not a formalised group with
initiations, rites, rituals etc., but rather a collective of like-minded
individuals which would co-opt others when appropriate. Similarly, P2 was
never a Masonic lodge in reality, but may have attempted to present itself
as such to hide its true agenda. This agenda was quite clearly to establish
a shadow government able to challenge and defeat the Communists should they
manage to seize power in Italy. P2 was supported by the Catholic Church,
Western Intelligence agencies, the financial and business sectors of Italy
and high-ranking Italian army officers.
DR: What is the true purpose of the Opus Dei, and how much power do they
have? Is there any connection between the Priory of Sion, the Knights of
Malta, and the Opus Dei? Are they involved with the CIA and with MI5, and if
so, why are these spy agencies interested?
GP: Opus Dei is a fundamentalist Catholic sect which is gaining increasing
power in the Vatican. It is known to have supported and received support
from Right wing dictatorships such as that of General Franco and the regimes
in South America. They run their own educational establishments and banks
through which they can wield influence and pursue their right wing Catholic
agenda - that is, complete control of the Roman Catholic Church. A common
denominator between the Catholic Church, Western governments, Right wing
regimes, Synarchic groups and International capitalists is the fight against
Communism. The Western Intelligence agencies set up networks after the war
known as `stay behind operations' to monitor and counter Communist
activities in several European countries. Despite their shared objective,
the various participants in this anti-Communist alliance continued to pursue
their own secret agendas. The full extent of the involvement of the Priory
of Sion associates in this world is not yet known and is the subject of
further research. With regard to the Intelligence activity, the story of
Sauniere and Rennes-le-Chateau may well be a smoke screen hiding the true
agendas of those involved, some of which have a past history of Nazi or
fascist collaboration.
DR: You've said that a former British Intelligence agent, Michael Bentine
warned the Rennes-le-Chateau Research Group that they "were getting into
dangerous territory?" What was the danger? Can you elaborate on this story?
GP: Michael Bentine was probably alluding to the existence of the `stay
behind operations' and the involvement of right wing politics. This aspect
of the Rennes-le-Chateau story was first hinted at in The Messianic Legacy
by Baigent, Lincoln and Leigh and has been further explored in Web of Gold.
The stakes in European politics are very high and I think that there has
been an attempt to dissuade research into certain critical areas.
DR: Are you convinced that the Pierre Plantard and other members of the
Priory of Sion were involved with the Nazi movement and the Vichy government
in France? If so, how does this reconcile with the Priory's seemingly
Zionist agenda, supporting the restoration of monarchy based on the Biblical
House of David?
GP: Plantard may not have been directly involved with the Nazi movement but
he was certainly a supporter of Marshal Pétain and his Vichy government. The
Vichy ideology was based on a belief in a national regeneration of France by
an elite which would promote a blend of Christian and Chivalric ideals. This
may have paralleled the Nazi agenda but was independent and strictly French.
As to the Priory of Sion - Jewish question, a differentiation between
political (and cultural) Zionism and the more religious Judaic tradition is
crucial. The Priory of Sion does not support Zionism, but in its Dossiers
Secrets does appear to acknowledge that Jesus Christ was of the biblical
line of David. A bloodline of Jesus, in which they include the Merovingian
monarchs, must therefore be Jewish. It is evident that the Priory of Sion
have had to find a mechanism of reconciling their essentially Christian
beliefs with Jesus's traditional Jewish roots. And this may well lie at the
heart of the Priory's mythology. It should be noted that during the war,
Vichy persecution of Jews was almost exclusively confined to the deportation
of Askenazi Jews that had fled into France from eastern Europe. The resident
Sephardic community was left largely untouched.
DR: You've said that the Priory's real agenda is right-wing politics, and
that the story of the bloodline of Jesus is just a cover. Does that mean
that they made up the whole "Grail bloodline" thing to begin with, and that
they don't really care about it at all? And why would they use such an
unorthodox cover anyway?
GP: It is entirely possible that those associated with the Priory of Sion do
believe in a bloodline of Jesus, but in the absence of any genuine
documentation they have created their own mythological evidence. However, I
don't believe that the protection of a physical bloodline is central to the
Priory's agenda. The symbolism of a Jesus bloodline is in fact another
variation of the tradition of Secret Masters, Unknown Superiors etc., found
in all synarchic groups that attempt to give a legitimacy to the imposition
of a ruling elite. By convincing people of the actual existence of a
bloodline of Jesus within a section of the nobility of France, the Priory
may believe it will be easier to achieve their synarchist agenda, and at the
same time, reduce the authority of the Vatican.
DR: Who's Roger-Rene Dagobert and what does he do, exactly?
GP: Roger-Rene Dagobert is a retired architect who lives in Nantes. He is of
the same family as the famous General Dagobert and has spent twenty years
researching his family. With some justification he has established a link
back to the Merovingians, but I think one must remain cautious in accepting
this as a proven fact. An ardent Protestant and Republican, he has made it
his mission to expose corruption especially amongst those whom he considers
to be a threat to the Republic. It is amongst these that he places the late
Pierre Plantard, his friends, and members of the Priory of Sion.
DR: Was Francois Mitterand involved with the Priory of Sion? Do you think
that they might have had a hand at putting him in power?
GP: Circumstantial evidence as outlined in Web of Gold certainly indicates
that Francois Mitterrand had close friends that may have been directly
connected to the Priory of Sion or at least were associated with some of its
members. Some of these friendships were formed during the war and involved
those who, like Mitterrand, worked for the Vichy government. It is from this
circle that Mitterrand received support (including financial) for his
presidential campaign.
DR: Did Mitterand protect newspaper publisher René Bousquet from prosecution
for war crimes because they both shared the secret of the Priory of Sion?
GP: Mitterrand's Vichy past was always a source of embarrassment to him and
he avoided discussion on it. Bousquet had been deeply entrenched in Vichy
politics having been Chief of Police and responsible for the deportation of
76,000 Jews from France to Germany. As part of the inner circle he would
have been aware of Mitterrand's interest in the treasure legends of the
Corbieres and the strange history of Rennes-le-Chateau. It was remarkably
fortuitous for Mitterrand and his cronies that just before Bousquet was to
attend a judicial enquiry he was shot at his home. Since he was not the only
one to suffer a sudden death at a convenient time, I think one can draw
one's own conclusions.
DR: Did the members of the Order of the Solar Temple know the secret of the
Templar treasure? If so, do you think this info was obtained from
psychically channeling dead Templars, as it was claimed, or did they obtain
it by more mundane means because of their descent from the Sovereign
Military Order of the Temple of Jerusalem?
GP: The original Solar Templars founded by Jacques Breyer were probably not
aware of the details of the Corbieres treasure since they concentrated their
efforts at Arginy. It was here that they attempted to raise the spirits of
the nine founding Templar knights. However, this original Order was
infiltrated and brought into the occult right-wing world of other
neo-Templar and so-called Chivalric Orders. It is this later manifestation
of the Solar temple that becomes associated with groups such as the
neo-Masonic lodge P2, the Sovereign and Military Order of the Temple of
Jerusalem, and those connected to the Priory of Sion.
DR: Was the Solar Temple most likely responsible for Grace Kelly's death?
GP: Not the membership as a whole, who were to suffer their own tragic ends,
but the close knit hierarchy whose agenda was far from spiritual. It is
known that many wealthy financiers, businessmen and women, and professional
people were specifically targeted for recruitment merely to divest them from
their money. It is possible that Princess Grace may well have been one of
the earliest victims.
DR: To what extent did Opus Dei and the Knights of Malta manipulate the
Serbian-Croatian conflict to their own advantage?
GP: Opus Dei and the Knights of Malta would have been acting on behalf of
the extreme traditionalists in the Vatican. The conflict in the former
Yugoslavia presented an opportunity both to halt the advance of Islam and
for the Roman Catholic Croatians to suppress the Orthodox Christian Serbs.
This was an easy conflict to manipulate since the Serbs had been persecuted
by the Croats during the Second World War and were incited to exact their
revenge.
DR: What precisely was Otto Skorzensky looking for at Montsegur and do you
think that he found it?
GP: According to US Col Howard Buechner, Skorzeny was sent to Montsegur by
Himmler, Bormann and Rosenberg, acting on their own account, to search for
the Holy Grail following the researches of Otto Rahn. With the tide of war
turning in the Allies' favour, they probably considered this a last
opportunity to get their hands on such a priceless treasure. It is indeed
possible that Skorzeny found something of value, probably a cache of ancient
coins, but I doubt if the Ark of the Covenant or other ancient artefacts
were discovered.
DR: What was St. Yves d'Alveydre's (founder of the fraternity known as the
Polaires) vision of Agartha and how did this relate to his political concept
of "Synarchy"?
GP: St. Yves believed that Agartha was an underground city in the centre of
Asia which was the home to a population of millions governed by a
spiritually enlightened elite headed by an Ethiopian `Sovereign Pontiff.' He
believed that this Agarthan civilisation was both spiritually and
technically more advanced than his. This form of elitist government is very
typical of the Synarchist ideal.
DR: Do you think that the Priory of Sion shares this belief in the concept
of Synarchy?
GP: The concept of Synarchy, that is government by an intellectual and
spiritually- aware elite, is common to many right-wing orientated
groups/sects.
DR: Do you think the core beliefs of the Priory of Sion include the concept
of Agartha?
GP: Although there are differences in interpretation, the concept of Agartha
is a symbolic archetype of this elite government. Plantard's wartime
publication, Vaincre, the literary organ of Alpha Galates, forerunner to the
Priory of Sion, certainly highlights the Agarthan concept.
DR: You said that St. Yves believed that the "Enlightened King of the World"
would come from Agartha. Do you know of any other groups or people who
believe this?
GP: There are a large number of groups, that in one way or another believe
in Agartha, Shamballa, Unknown Superiors, Divine Monarchs, Hidden Masters
and the many variations on these themes. But essentially they are all part
of an elitist ideology that rejects popular democracy.
DR: What do you consider Martinism to be derivative of? Is it largely of
Masonic origin, but pro-Catholic?
GP: Martinism is undeniably a branch of mystical Christianity. Founded by
Martines de Pasqually and developed by Louis Claude de Saint-Martin, it was
an attempt to find personal spiritual enlightenment through magic, the
Cabala and the power of Christ. It never was, and still isn't, Masonic in
the true sense but Papus, by association with other occult pursuits, brought
Martinism into the neo-Masonic world. During the late 19th century occult
revival, there was a proliferation of esoteric societies which have
gradually been drawn into the neo-Masonic fold.
DR: Do the Martinists still embrace the concept of Synarchy?
GP: It is very difficult to compare the original Martinism with the later
groups, often the result of splits or natural evolution, that carry the
name, such as the OMS - Ordre Matiniste Synarchique. I certainly cannot
reply for all Martinists, but it would be fair to say that many of those
drawn to Martinism would probably support some sort of Synarchic model.
DR: Is it likely that Jules Verne was initiated into the secrets of the
Merovingian Dynasty, and if so, by whom?
GP: I wouldn't want to comment on the extent of Verne's involvement with the
Merovingian cause or associated sects, as I have never seen any direct
proof. However, from his novel Clovis Dardentor, it appears that he was
aware of the legends of treasure in the Corbieres and its possible link with
the displaced Merovingian kings. Whether the allusion to these themes in his
book is artistic licence or insider knowledge is open to debate.
DR: What do you think are the origins of the Protocols of the Learned Elders
of Zion?
GP: A proto-type for the Protocols appeared in Martinist documents from the
late 19th century. The Martinist leader Papus was anti-Semitic and believed
in a Jewish-Zionist agenda to dominate Europe. It is believed that it was
through his instigation that the first Protocols were concocted to discredit
the Jewish community. Papus was a supporter of a Christian-based Synarchic
government as a counter to his perceived Zionist plot.
DR: What is meant by the term "Great Monarch", which Charles de Gaulle
believed himself to be..' What did you mean when you said that Mitterand was
considered "more of a monarch than a president"?
GP: Both de Gaulle and Mitterrand considered themselves to have a specific
and possible divine mission to restore a former greatness to France.
Whatever their public political stance, they both subscribed to elitism in
the Synarchist model. Just like the absolute kings of the ancient regime,
they adopted a paternalistic attitude towards government, with a certain
contempt for their electorate. It is in this sense they both saw themselves
as the archetypal "Great Monarch" - a belief that dominated the style and
nature of their politics.
DR: Do you believe that a new Temple of Jerusalem is in the works and that
as Rabbi Ariel Bar Tzadok claims, the cornerstone has already been laid? If
so, is it likely that the Ark and other paraphernalia will be returned once
it is done?
GP: I have no reason to believe that preparations for the new Temple of
Jerusalem are not well in hand and that the cornerstone has not already been
laid. Rebuilding the Temple is one of the ultimate aims of both the
religious orthodox Jews and the political Zionists. As to the restoration of
the Jewish treasures there is no evidence that such artifacts have been
found - other than the highly questionable statement by Pierre Plantard on
behalf of the Priory of Sion.
DR: Can you elaborate on your idea that the World Jewish Congress is trying
to destroy the Swiss banking system so that certain Jewish families can
control more of the industry?
GP: The consistent attack on the Swiss banking system and demand for
Holocaust-centred compensation orchestrated by the World Jewish Council
certainly appears to have a hidden agenda. Many other countries, and even
the Vatican, have been shown to have profited from so-called Nazi gold but
have not been subjected to the same pressures. A collapse in confidence in
Swiss banks would result in a transfer of enormous financial power from
Europe to America. Whether one subscribes to conspiracy theories or not, it
is a fact that control of global finance results in control of
multi-national and global industries and ultimately of individual national
governments. Of course not all American-based banks are controlled by Jews,
but a number are, and would stand to gain from a reduction in power of Swiss
banks.
DR: Is there any chance that we will see the return of "Divine Right"
monarchy in our lifetimes because of the work of these secret societies?
GP: It is impossible to predict the future. If Western Capitalism were to
collapse, the resulting power vacuum would give rise to unimaginable
conflict and hardship. History has shown so far that the victors of these
situations are usually dictators supported by the far Right or far Left. The
concept of a spiritually benevolent "Divine Monarch" is probably only an
idealistic dream which could never become a reality.
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