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Virus- L Digest, Vol 1, Issue 51
NOTICE: TO ALL CONCERNED Certain text files and messages contained on this site deal with activities and devices which would be in violation of various Federal, State, and local laws if actually carried out or constructed. The webmasters of this site do not advocate the breaking of any law. Our text files and message bases are for informational purposes only. We recommend that you contact your local law enforcement officials before undertaking any project based upon any information obtained from this or any other web site. We do not guarantee that any of the information contained on this system is correct, workable, or factual. We are not responsible for, nor do we assume any liability for, damages resulting from the use of any information on this site.
From: Kenneth R. van Wyk (The Moderator) <[email protected]>
Errors-To: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
BCC: [email protected]
Subject: VIRUS-L Digest V1 #51
Reply-to: [email protected]
--text follows this line--
VIRUS-L Digest Monday, 19 Dec 1988 Volume 1 : Issue 51
Today's Topics:
Trapdisk (PC)
Re: Write protected disk written, etc. (PC & general)
Debrain.C (PC)
low level format for PC/XT
Confusion about the Brain virus. (PC)
Brain Virus (PC)
How safe are write-protect tabs? (PC)
Common sense re: software suppliers
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 88 13:59:46 -0800
From: Steve Clancy <[email protected]>
Subject: Trapdisk (PC)
I have used Trapdisk in the past and am very pleased with it.
Trapdisk is a newer version of something that used to be called BOMB.
I like it because it allows a command line, such as TRAPDISK WF as a
command to write protect your disk against a write or format. I also
like being able to disable it at will (TRAPDISK U), but I do not like
that it remains memory resident. There is also another very good
program called HDSENTRY.
I'm afraid that I cannot comment on how well either handle
sophisticated attempts to get around their protection.
- -- Steve
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
| Steve Clancy | WELLSPRING RBBS |
| Biomedical Library | 714-856-7996 24 HRS |
| P.O. Box 19556 | 300-9600 N,8,1 |
| University of California, Irvine | 714-856-5087 nites/wkends |
| Irvine, CA 92713 | 300-1200 N,8,1 |
| | |
| SLCLANCY@UCI | "Are we having fun yet?" |
| [email protected] | |
| | |
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 88 21:25:07 EST
From: "Homer W. Smith" <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Write protected disk written, etc. (PC & general)
> I found that if I booted a machine with an infected disk,
> and then put a new clean boot disk WITH A WRITE PROTECT
> TAB in the same machine and performed a warm boot, the new
> disk also became infected. Nothing short of turning the
> machine off and then back on was safe enough.
How can a disk with a write tab on it become infected?
As some of you know I run a small home company called ART MATRIX.
We produce and sell many items related to fractals like videos and
slide sets etc. We also offer program disk on IBM 5" disks that have
nothing but fortran source code, no system, no nothing but ascii
files. I presume these disks are ABSOLUTELY SAFE in ALL
CIRCUMSTANCES.
We have for a long time been considering selling a MAC disk that
would introduce the user to fractals that was written in Forth and was
highly interactive and very much executable code. With all this virus
stuff going around I have had to have second thoughts.
For one, ART MATRIX is not a corporation and has no corporate veil
to hide behind in case of litigation. We are a partnership and
and law suit could ruin me personally.
From what I can see, there is no absolutely safe way to guarantee
that the disks I send out are virus free, and no safe way to prove
they WERE virus free if they should later become infected.
Thus what on EARTH would motivate me to produce this disk
and risk my LIFE selling it to a world wide audience. We have
many people clamoring for this disk, but now with the news
that fresh disks from reputable factories have viruses, I just
cant see my way to getting into the business.
1.) Who is legally liable for a virus if a new disk bought by a
customer has one? How does one prove that one did one's best to
insure the disk was virus free? Does it matter that one did one's
best or is it always the manufacturer's fault?
2.) Should I produce the disk?
3.) What is going to happen to the software industry as a whole?
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Dec 88 00:03 EDT
From: Paul Coen <[email protected]>
Subject: Debrain.C (PC)
I received a copy of debrain.c some time ago, and I finally
got around to attempting to compile it (Turbo C). Basically, it
wouldn't compile, I was getting syntax errors (particularly on the \
character in the code). I don't know C, so I'm having some trouble
figuring out what's wrong. The version of Turbo C I got from our
software library is 1.0, could that have something to do with it? Any
help would be appreciated. Oh, and just to keep all of you
happy....this is for the IBM PC/XT/AT and compatables. With the Brain
virus popping up right and left all of a sudden, I'd feel more
comfortable with a running copy of this around.
Side note: We've got about a 1.1 to 1 computer to student
ratio here, and we've yet to get hit with any kind of a virus. I'm
keeping my fingers crossed!
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Paul R. Coen Student Operator, Drew University Academic Computer Center |
| Bitnet: PCOEN@DRUNIVAC U.S. Snail: Drew University CM Box 392, |
| PCOEN@DREW Madison, NJ 07940 |
| Disclaimer: I represent my own reality. |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Dec 88 06:55:29 EST
From: "Homer W. Smith" <[email protected]>
Subject: low level format for PC/XT
Again I want to thank all who offered help on low level
formats of my PC/XT hard drive.
Nearly everyone mentioned the debug g=c800:5 but on my
machine this produces nothing. How do I find the correct
starting address for my machine. How do I find out what kind
of disk drive is in it? By taking off the cover and looking
at it?
There seems to be some confusion about what the format command
does. Some say it erases only the FAT entries which as good as makes
the data on the disk unusable. The manual seems to imply that the
data on the disk is actually erased. If it is not erasing the data
why does it take so long?
What real danger is there to doing just a format in terms
of leaving virus remanants behind?
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Dec 88 12:10 EST
From: <[email protected]>
Subject: Confusion about the Brain virus. (PC)
This concerns the discussion about the Brain virus in the VIRUS-L digest.
> I found that if I booted a machine with an infected disk,
> and then put a new clean boot disk WITH A WRITE PROTECT
> TAB in the same machine and performed a warm boot, the new
> disk also became infected. Nothing short of turning the
> machine off and then back on was safe enough.
When I found some of my 5.25" floppies infected with the Brain virus,
some folks at the labs and computing center told me that a
write-protected disk couldn't get infected because the
write-protection mechanism was "hardware controlled" and couldn't be
circumvented by any software. So I was confused when I read the lines
(above) because the information given to me by the lab operators is
wrong and it is possible to bypass "write-protection" using software.
Could some one please explain
1. Why a warm boot by itself is not enough to prevent the spread of
infection
2. How a write-protected boot disk could get infected during warm boot.
This could be very helpful to a lot of us (the PC user community at
Virginia Tech) who don't know too much about the operation of Viruses.
Thanks in advance.
- -Mathew Mathai
- ----------------------
Virginia Tech |
Bitnet : mathai@vtcc1 |
- ----------------------
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 18 Dec 88 12:45:46 EDT
From: <[email protected]>
Subject: Brain Virus (PC)
Ok here is what I did. I formatted 7 brand new disks fresh out of the
box from a copy of DOS I know is clean and secure. I checked the 0,0
on the disk to be s ure BRAIN WAS NOT HIDING THERE. I then unwrapped
the word processing program and follwed the instructions to in stall
the program onto the floppy disks. I then checked the 7 disks and
found the BRAIN logo on 0,0 which is where it is know to hide, on all
of the disks. So, perhaps you can tell me where else it could have
come from if not direct fr om the manufacturer's disks?
I will not publish the name of the manufacturer (because we know those
people in Utah can get testy sometimes) but I have answered all
private requests for the companies name.
[Ed. Fair enough...]
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 18 Dec 88 15:07:42 EST
From: Naama Zahavi-Ely <[email protected]>
Subject: How safe are write-protect tabs? (PC)
Hello!
A non-expert question: how secure are write-protect tabs against
viruses? Are write-protect tabs based on hardware (ie the drive will
not write on a disk with a write-protect tab on, no matter what)? Or
is it simply a matter of an error code, which might be disregarded by
a clever virus? It is well known that file write-protection is easily
circumvented by viruses; it is also well-known that viruses can
prevent a write-protection error code from being displayed after
trying to write to a tab-write-protected diskette. Can a virus
actually write to a tab-write-protected diskette? There has been a
report recently on Virus-L of an infection of a write-protected
diskette -- unfortunatly without any details. Since I, and I am sure
many others, used to regard write-protect tabs as completely secure
(as long as they are left on!), I would appreciate very much any
information to the contrary.
Thanks and have a good holiday period!
Naama
+ -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- +
| Naama Zahavi-Ely |
| Project ELI E-MAIL [email protected] |
| Yale Computer Center |
| 175 Whitney Ave |
| New Haven, CT 06520 |
| (203) 432-6600 ext. 341 |
+ -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- +
------------------------------
From: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 18-Dec-88 12:49:30 PST
Subject: Common sense re: software suppliers
In article <16 December 88, 16:46:22> <RZOTTO at DKNKURZ1> Otto Stolz
writes:
>You are right insofar that even they are not infallable. However, you
>can be sure that they will undertake every possible attempt to
>minimize impact on their customers (they will suffer great losses if
>they won't succeed). At least you know whom to sue for lost property
>:-)
First, the number of commercial programs being distributed with
viruses (*known viruses* - they could have easily detected and
prevented them) is growing weekly.
Second, the license agreements of most or all software packages
prevent you from suing the distributor or author for lost property.
>This kind of malice shakes our society to its very foundations; it
>resembles offering toxic or rotten food in a restaurant, or loosening
>bolts at the steering assembly of other people's cars.
Both of the acts you mention have a very limited scope, and do not
affect more than a tiny fraction of the population. I'd think a more
accurate comparison would be someone who creates an AIDS vaccine for
himself, then infects himself with AIDS and deliberately has sexual
contact with as many people as possible.
>However, a certain amount of caution can be expected from the customer's
>side: you probably would not go out to a dirty restaurant, and you would
>ask everybody (even your friends) what they were doing under your car, if
>you caught them working there and hadn't asked them for help. My recent
>note meant to establish this sort of common sense for receiving and
>running programs, now we all have heard of possible virus carriers.
Even nice, clean people get AIDS. The untrustworthy person has
intercourse with a slightly more trustworthy person, and that person
has intercourse with a slightly more trustworthy person, and so on.
Or a really trustworthy person suffers a single lapse of judgement.
Etc., etc. And software 'condoms' are a lot harder to come by, given
the nature of computing devices.
>> Sometimes even the people writing the software do not understand all of
>> it.
>
>Then, they'd better attend a course in structured programming or give
>up programming, altogether.
I personally know of a software project that is in excess of ten
million lines of code. I dare anyone to (within ten years) read and
understand in detail all of it.
Dan Hankins
------------------------------
End of VIRUS-L Digest
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