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Finale Digest for 1/95

Finale 1995-01 TEXTttxt ???? ?? ?nuh?nv" Archive-Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:25:12 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:22:09 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale Bug (fwd)

Tim, you might try creating and booting with a second system folder that
has an older system (7.1, for example) and an older laserwriter driver (7.0,
for example) and booting up with that system and driver. There's no reason
you have to use 7.5 and driver v.8 for Finale 3.2, and it might solve your
problem. The reason WHY it might doesn't matter, but if it were me I'd try
having second system folder and using it and see if it solves the problem.

--Richard Huggins
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:51:15 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:51:33 -0600
Message-ID: <v01510100ab42adcf6168@[130.179.240.55]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Randolph Peters)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale and SampleCell

Mark D. Henderson wrote:

>Has anyone had any luck getting Finale to support SampleCell for playback
>of score files? I talked to Coda and they have no intention of providing a
>driver for SampleCell or supporting OMS (which would take care of the
>problem). The only alternative is to go with Midi Manager, and I hate the
>thought of opening that Pandora's box in my macintosh.

I use Finale (Mac) and SampleCell all the time with good results. You do
have to use MidiManager to make it work, but it is not the Pandora's box
that it used to be. (Make sure you get the latest version--2.0.2). There
are some advantages to using MidiManager, (I have a MacIIci, SampleCell I,
and the Midi Time Piece. Your mileage may vary.):

1) You get access to 32 midi channels without having to unplug your printer.
2) You don't have to turn off AppleTalk.
3) You can send faxes from Finale by turning off the MidiManager in the
patcher and selecting your fax/modem in the chooser.
4) Other software may let you bypass the MidiManager without having to take
it out of your extensions folder and restarting.

We could get more than 32 channels in Finale if Coda would adhere to OMS or
something similar, but it doesn't seem that this will happen soon. Good
luck.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Randolph Peters
[email protected]
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:54:21 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: 18 Jan 95 14:53:51 EST
From: Thom Gandet <73734.3463@compuserve.com>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: List-server <[email protected]>
Subject: Info request
Message-ID: <950118195350_73734.3463_CHL91-3@CompuServe.COM>

I read of the Finale mailing list on the CIS Coda Forum and would like to
subscribe to it.

Regards,
Thom Gandet

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:49:46 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 16:50:27 -0500
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Gil Plantinga)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale Bug (fwd)

>(>From Nicola LeFanu, Music Department, University of York etc.
>
>HELP REQUEST for FINALE 3.2 BUG:
>
> non-printing of Smart Shapes in Finale 3.2 for Macintosh.
>

This is a known bug and is fixed in the 3.2.1 maintenance upgrade.

I don't know if the smart shapes will still have to be re-entered :-(
My sympathies...

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Gil Plantinga
New Paltz, NY
(914) 255-2775
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:57:03 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:50:20 -0600
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Is Finale 3.x for Windows Any Good?

Tyson writes;

> I have a copy of Finale 2.01 (or whatever) for Windows. As a Windows
> developer (as with many Finale users), I have found Finale to be powerful
> but counter-user-intuitive (Ctrl-Shift-DoubleClick ... give me a break).

You're absolutely correct. It IS a little on the weird side, isn't it?
Weird equates to unusual, and unusual is driven by what (or whom) is
usual. Microsoft Word is usual. Word Perfect is usual. Procomm for Windows
was criticized for being unusual because it didn't follow the "standard".
The same is true for the "Ctrl-Shift-DoubleClick" situation in Finale.

Microsoft has a standard of sorts in its Development Library. The
"User Interface Design Guide" is intended to keep programmers thinking
along the same lines so that a word processor has the same "Look and Feel"
as a spread-sheet, or a desk top publisher, or a garage door opener. The
trouble is, Finale has been around much longer than the Design Guide.

This is an area where our Macintosh friends have a distinct advantage.
Apple has been quite explicit about their user interface.

Personally, I don't have any problem with Coda's key definitions. When
you use an application enough, you forget about the mechanics and focus
on the task.

> So, aside from the UI, does Finale 3.x exhibit any of the GPFs, UAEs,
> system hangs that Finale 2.x had? E.g., dying while perform an Edit
> Recalc, or Page Layout, or MassEdit [subcommand here].

Finale for Windows 3 is a dramatic improvement over version 2.01. I
highly recommend you invest the $100 (+shipping, if you order from Coda).
So far, I've not encountered any protection faults, or unrecoverable
application errors, but don't be surprised if they occur. The best
programmers make mistakes. Murphy's law began with the fall of man.
You can protect yourself by saving your files frequently, and backing
up your system. Finale is probably not perfect, but it is the best.

I have had one problem with Hyperscribe. When trying to quickly enter
a treble part, and supplying the metronome with a simple bass note,
I was unable to get any notation. The Hyperscribe boxes filled with data,
but nothing was transcribed. Since I was in a hurry, I really didn't
try to figure out the problem; I don't use Hyperscribe very much
anyway.

The transcription tool is much easier to use. I frequently use it to
enter complex parts initially. It is far more intuitive, and seems
to require less error correction.

> Is Finale 3.x stable? Is there a file conversion and does it occur
> smoothly?
> Are the fonts better? TrueType support? Do the fonts convert nicely (if
> applicable)? Faster execution (e.g., Edit Recalc)? Can it create correct
> MIDI files? Does it print faster?

Stability, like love, is in the eyes of the beholder.

File conversion is performed on all Finale 2 data. For safety, you are
required to explicitly name the converted file with "SAVE AS". It's a
good idea to set all of your default fonts before you do any real work.
There is a README file that should be read and noted.

True Type fonts are available if you have correctly installed them
from the Windows control panel. Be careful if you don't have much
memory (8 Meg or less). Fonts take a lot of system resources.
(Petrucci and Seville are installed by the Finale installer program.)
When you print to a local PostScript printer, True Type fonts look
great (in my experience). Transporting a print file to a remote
printer (such as a publisher) is another matter. This Finale list is
replete with stories of unrecognized or modified fonts. I have
frequently created list files with Finale 2.01 (including Petrucci),
and had no problems printing them, provided I used standard PS fonts.
Since installing Finale 3, I have had no such need, and can't say
for certain that it still works.

MIDI files are created properly, as far as I can tell.

Printing speed is difficult to judge. PostScript printers spend most of
their time creating the image. If you need multiple copies, never ask
Finale to produce them for you. Instead, instruct the print driver to
output several copies. (This is done either from the "Print setup"
menu in Finale, or from the Windows control panel. It may not be
available on some printers.) In this manner, the first page of each
multiple copy will take a long time, but subsequent copies of the
same page will be output at the maximum rate of the printer. You will,
of course, need to hand collate.

Lance Philip Strugar
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 16:50:11 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 17:46:42 EST
From: "TBQ Press" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Finale 3 Maint release

Is the current maint. release for Finale 3 (Windows) available on any FTP
server?
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:20:38 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:21:11 -0500
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Gil Plantinga)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Collisions -- Coda cares!?

I gleaned this from Compu$erve today:

>From: Coda Tech Support, 75300,3727
>To: All
>Topic: Collision between layers
>Msg #42095
>Section: Coda Music Tech. [5]
>Forum: MIDI B Vendor+
>Date: Tue, Jan 17, 1995, 11:30:13 AM
>
>The following is from a discussion I had with one of our developers regarding
>a user's suggestion. Please feel free to share your comments.
>
>>>Perhaps you could run this by the users out there. Collision avoidance
>>>between layers is one of our most-requested items. There are some technical
>>>barriers, certainly (I think we've discussed some, you and I), but the
>>>biggest barrier at this time is one of expectations.
>
>The main problem with collision between layers is that there are so many
>possibilities to account for. We hesitate to implement an incomplete solution
>because users can be merciless in their scorn when they think you've done a
>half-assed job. My question to the "cognizetti" (sp?) is "would you be content
>with a partial solution at first? And what would that solution include? What
>situations do you have to deal with most often?"
>
>Difficulties include (but are not limited to): placement of dots and
>accidentals, stem positioning, co-existence w/ manual positioning.
>Gardner Read's "Music Notation" (2nd ed.) contains some excellent examples of
>the difficulties one would have to surmount (pp 68-70, 134).
>
>You can feel free to post this entire note if you wish. I expect most people
>will respond that anything is better than nothing, but I want to give people a
>chance to help decide which "anything" we start with. <<
>
>Scott
>
>Coda Music Technology

Well, all I can say is "GLORY HALLEUJAH!" I've only been asking in letters,
faxes, email, heated discussions with David Pogue since the winter of 1990.
Golly, even if they do a half-assed job something's gotta be better than
nuthin'

=:0


%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Gil Plantinga
New Paltz, NY
(914) 255-2775
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:01:04 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:01:37 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Collisions -- Coda cares!?
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Gil
I read the same note regarding layer collisions and am also
encouraged. I feel that if Coda can solve the problem of simple, single note
(undotted, opposite facing stems) collisions with the Mass Mover
metatools while not disabling any of the manual positioning available
now, it would be a tremendous step forward. While they are at it if they
make the special tools into a pallette of tools which would work at
*magnified views,* wow!! I can only imagine the potiential for solving the
sticky problems which we can only come close to now. While you have been
talking about collisions for the last few years I have been lobbying for
a magnifiable (is that a word) special tools mode or (even a
magnifiable window if they still want to keep it that limited.) The fact
that they are finally (Finaley) getting around to the collisions problem
gives me hope that the Special Tools innovations may be moving up the list.
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:18:32 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 00:20:12 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale Bug (fwd)

Update your 3.2 to the new 3.2.1/ Call Coda, it's free.
I've also had this problem with 3.2
It's been fixed in 3.2.1 or so they say.
[email protected].
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:02:06 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:59:19 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: SET Finale NOMAIL

SET Finale NOMAIL
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 07:57:38 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 07:54:07 -0600 (CST)
From: Brian J Campbell <brianjc@jove.acs.unt.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale Mail-list <[email protected]>
Subject: 3.2.1 Upgrader
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950119075311.21495A-100000@jove.acs.unt.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I saw an earlier post about putting this on one of the FTP's, but I never
read anything after that. Is it now possible for those of us not on AOL
to get a copy??

Brian Campbell
/----------------\
|-----------------------------------|----------------------------------------|
|STUCK at UNT Department of Music |INTERNET: brianjc@jove.acs.unt.edu |
|in lovely Denton, Texas, USA |Snail:526 Alegre Vista;Denton, TX 76205 |
|Jazz/Arranging/Comp/Saxophone/Winds|Voice: (817) 382-7131 |
|-----------(It's not a town, just an Incredible Simulation)-----------------|
\__________________________________________________________________/

A Hypothetical Paradox:
Who would win in a battle between the red-shirted members of an
Enterprise security team, who always die in the first five minutes of an
episode, and a legion of Imperial Stormtroopers, who can't hit the broad
side of a planet?

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:09:46 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:11:15 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Who owns data file?

Robert Patterson writes:

>>Let's not kid ourselves here, folks. The personal touch comes from personal
sweat equity, NOT from any magic Finale settings. It's true that you can save
some time for yourself by tweaking the settings, but engraver-quality spacing
requires manual layout of every measure, and this is not a feature
that is somehow embedded in the file<< ... >>I scoff at the notion that
professional secrets are somehow embedded in a Finale default file.<<
-----------
Robert,

It seems to me that parameters that "save some time" in making a
Finale-generated part look great CAN be considered "professional secrets."
Most people who have a beef with Finale cite its steep learning curve. It
takes novices time to learn how to get things to look as intended (i.e."sweat
equity"). Templates grow out of our desire to hold onto discoveries that make
a part look better, and as time goes by we all discover more and more stuff
that gives a particular desired "look." Who wants to enter all that stuff
into a new file for every job? The net sum of all these tweaked settings
gives us a personally designed piece of virtual "manuscript paper" to start
every job with. Significant.

Here's list of things that have been modified in my template (off the top of
my head):

Page margins and percentage, staff distances, target measure widths, Clef
designer and clef chg settings, grace note size, articulation handles, tuplet
number adjustment and definitions, text-shape-articulation-chord suffix libs,
allotment tables, text repeat setup, tie settings (I believe they DO work),
default fonts and custom font work, block rest spacing and positioning, line
thickness adjustments, headers and titles, slur thickness and arcs, measure #
setup...

Well I've run out of steam, but you'll have a hard time convincing me that
parameter adjustments have not become an important part of the skills
required for professional copy/engraving with computers. Of course you still
have to be an engraver/copyist to understand the musical layout of pages
etc., but to me a good template gives a significant competitive edge to
anyone who knows how to use it. It's not worth giving away.

Don Rice - Brooklyn
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:15:49 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:16:33 -0500
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Gil Plantinga)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Collisions -- Coda cares!?

> I read the same note regarding layer collisions and am also
>encouraged. I feel that if Coda can solve the problem of simple, single note
>(undotted, opposite facing stems) collisions with the Mass Mover
>metatools while not disabling any of the manual positioning available
>now, it would be a tremendous step forward. While they are at it if they
>make the special tools into a pallette of tools which would work at
>*magnified views,* wow!! I can only imagine the potiential for solving the
>sticky problems which we can only come close to now. While you have been
>talking about collisions for the last few years I have been lobbying for
>a magnifiable (is that a word) special tools mode or (even a
>magnifiable window if they still want to keep it that limited.) The fact
>that they are finally (Finaley) getting around to the collisions problem
>gives me hope that the Special Tools innovations may be moving up the list.

Larry,

I'll second that. The inconsistency of the special tools -- moving
accidentals by dragging (and they don't move where you put them anyway and
now in 3.2.1 seem to have a mind of their own) but entering EVPUs for dots
and ties (no vertical adjustment possible except globally) which at least
works) and all in that tiny window is a nightmare.

I've got a wish list a mile long...

Specifically regarding the collision problem, I agree that it would be fine
to have the problem solved only for simple situations without dots or
accidentals.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Gil Plantinga
New Paltz, NY
(914) 255-2775
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:23:47 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 07:23:11 -0700 (MST)
From: Jane Frasier <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale Bug (fwd)
To: [email protected], [email protected]
CC: [email protected]
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Thu, 19 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:

> Update your 3.2 to the new 3.2.1/ Call Coda, it's free.

What's the phone number please?
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:17:50 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:17:26 -0700 (MST)
From: Mark Basinski - UA School of Music <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: stuff to customize
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Don Rice writes:

>Here's list of things that have been modified in my template (off the top of
>my head):
>
>Page margins and percentage, staff distances, target measure widths, Clef
>designer and clef chg settings, grace note size, articulation handles, tuplet
>number adjustment and definitions, text-shape-articulation-chord suffix libs,
>allotment tables, text repeat setup, tie settings (I believe they DO work),
>default fonts and custom font work, block rest spacing and positioning, line
>thickness adjustments, headers and titles, slur thickness and arcs, measure #
>setup...

Now, this is GREAT! Thanks Don! I find this kind of information very useful -
just having a set of suggestions of *what* one should modify (or consider
modifying) in order to set up the "virtual manuscript" for one's own desired
custom look. Of course, it would be even greater (from the point of view of
those of us without so much experience) to have those WITH it to just give away
their custom setting, but as the "who owns the data file" thread has
demonstrated, there are quite sensible reasons that those folks might not wish
to give all their secrets away! I think it is a very important point for anyone
wanting to get a better look to just have the above list of thigs to tinker
with.

Without wanting anyone to give up their own secret settings, what are some
other *general* suggestions of favorite types of things to adjust (I recall a
fairly detailed allotment settings posted a while back)? Obviously, as
mentioned by someone else in the other thread, it is essential for folks
wanting a more "professional" look to get to know what is involved in whatever
it is that they consider such, with the various reference books (Read, Ross,
etc.) being very important for that kind of understanding.

Mark Basinski University of Arizona
Adjunct Assistant Professor School of Music

[email protected] (602) 621-7470

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:28:20 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:29:24 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu (John C. Werner)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale Bug (fwd)

>On Thu, 19 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:
>
>> Update your 3.2 to the new 3.2.1/ Call Coda, it's free.
>
>
>What's the phone number please?

612 937 9703

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:55:30 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:52:46 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale PC problems

Mark Henderson writes:
>measures that have been converted to slash notation (usually >just quarter
notes originally) will not accommodate spacing
>(either note or beat).<<

On these rhythm parts just set measures to "time signature" spacing since it
won't affect much else. BTW it doesn't matter what the original is.

John Blane
Blane Music Preparation
Chicago, IL 60607
(312) 455-1100
[email protected]
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:55:48 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:53:07 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
CC: [email protected]
Subject: Re: non-printing of Smart Shapes

Tim Anderson

This problem supposedly is fixed in version 3.2.1. If you can't get that in
time, the problem is avoided by making eps files of each page. (Probably not
a good work-around under the circumstances but all smart shapes will appear.)

Hope you get it worked out!

John Blane
Blane Music Preparation
Chicago, IL 60607
(312) 455-1100
(312)455-1162 (Fax)
[email protected]
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:19:35 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Robert Patterson <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale News Group <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: stuff to customize
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 95 11:21:00 CST
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Sorry, folks. I am still unconvinced on the settings issue. One of the
previous postings nailed it on the head: any one who is serious competition
will have their own style and preferences. Anyone who blindly takes someone
else's settings is certainly not going to be serious competition. And,
ultimately, the settings buy you very little. It is the individual editing,
the commitment to do them and the skill and taste that allow you to them,
that make you valuable to potential customers. Reading a few reference books
(Read, Ross, and Stone for instance) plus no more than 3-4 hrs of
experimentation will give anyone reasonable settings.

Personally, I have adjusted:

music font
music font size
music font characters
line widths
default slur curvature
the new smart slur placement
horizontal distances between items
tie shape and placement
default font settings for all text objects
custom smart articulations
spacing allotments

BTW: you can mathematically calculate your allotments to the last EVPU and
it will do you squat good in v3 of either mac or windows. Note Spacing
barely notices your allotment table, leading to much gnashing of teeth on my
part since I started using v3. The old 2 steps forward, 1 step back shuffle,
I guess. And, of course Note Spacing, in all but very specialized cases, is
what you must use to get professional engraver-quality punctuation.

To prove that I, at least, put my "money" where my mouth is, I will mention
that several months ago I posted a file to this list in uuencoded format. It
contained all my pre-v3.2 settings. I don't know if it is still out there in
a digest or not. If there is interest I will repost it. Heck, I can just
post the ETF straight up, since ETF's are nothing but text anyway.

One "Finale" word of warning to those of you who think that secret settings
are somehow earning you money: get a new skill. I expect that withing five
to ten yrs, Finale or one of its competitors will be so good at such things
that everyone will have access to them. (What I really mean here is that
your skill is not in your ability to set defaults, but in your commitment to
learning the whole process and learning the standards of engraving practice:
skills that most certainly are NOT in your ability set defaults or set up
templates, which any computer-literate fool can do.)

R.
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:40:33 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:40:57 -0600
Message-ID: <v01510104ab43f2a4d844@[130.179.244.48]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Randolph Peters)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Value of a good copyist
CC: [email protected]

>Of course you still
>have to be an engraver/copyist to understand the musical layout of pages
>etc., but to me a good template gives a significant competitive edge to
>anyone who knows how to use it. It's not worth giving away.
>
>Don Rice - Brooklyn

You raise some real concerns, but I don't think that Finale settings, as
intricate as they may be, constitute a protected trade secret. The
promotion of high engraving/copying standards is a wiser and more lucrative
business strategy than trying to protect your corner of the turf. You could
be seen as good source and educator about copying and engraving standards.
That would probably increase the demand for your services rather than
diminish them.

What happens when someone sells or gives away great templates? (It might
happen on this list.) Or heaven forbid, what do you do when CODA's default
files start containing more sophisticated settings?Are you out of business?
I seriously doubt it.

Your worth as a copyist is in what you know and in your experience, not in
your settings.

This is what I value in a copyist:
1) musical experience,
2) excellent proofreading skills,
3) speed,
4) great printouts (high resolution printer).

The first quality encompasses the ability to do smart cues, good page
turns, good enharmonic changes in transposing instruments, and any other
contextual modifications that will help the rehearsal process. It also
includes the ability to make the score or page look right. These are
usually adjustments done by hand after the settings have kicked in. Items
3) and 4) are helped by your equipment and software, but they are not as
valuable as the first two qualities.

Finale and the current generation of computers will eventually become
obsolete, but your knowledge and experience will be the lasting value.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Randolph Peters
[email protected]
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:51:24 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 13:51:53 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu (John C. Werner)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Question re block rests and clefs

I'll try this again. I'll just plunge in here and ask a question that will
make clear what a novice I am. I use Finale 3.2 on the Mac (and, yes, I
have called for 3.2.1 which was courteously granted.)

Please forgive the relatively mundane nature of this question, but can
someone tell me how to avoid collision between a clef change and a block
rest. Writing cello orchestral parts this is a common issue for me. Often
before a block rest the part will be written in bass clef, while after the
rest the part will be in tenor or treble clef. I've been using breaks in
block rests to create a single measure rest that I can adjust in part
extraction to a size that accomodates the clef and the block rest symbol.
(It looks ridiculous, but gets the message across, and I have not gotten to
the point of wishing to publish any material.) Or must I make sure the
clef change is noted before the block rest. This isn't the case in most
published material I've encountered.

Chris Werner, former bank teller, band director, pediatric cardiologist
and father.

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 13:20:48 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected] (Andrian Pervazov)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Finale PC problems
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 14:20:52 -0500 (EST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

[email protected] wrote:
>
> Mark Henderson writes:
> >measures that have been converted to slash notation (usually >just quarter
> notes originally) will not accommodate spacing
> >(either note or beat).<<
>
> On these rhythm parts just set measures to "time signature" spacing since it
> won't affect much else. BTW it doesn't matter what the original is.

I think this problem was mentioned as solved in the reame file for FinWin
3.0.2

--
Andrian Pervazov
Music Department, University of Pennsylvania
Internet: [email protected] Phone: 215-732-2053
Postscript scores at ftp://ftp.gmd.de/music/scores/pervazov
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 13:25:18 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Robert Patterson <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale News Group <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: Question re block rests and clefs
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 95 13:27:00 CST
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

You have encountered one of Finale's little irritants. The best way to avoid
collision is to set your Measure Rest width to something wide enough to
accommodate both the Measure Rest shape and any clef change that may occur.
(Change the width setting *before* turning on Special Part Extraction or as
you turn it on: if Special Part Extraction is already checked, changing the
width does you no good until you turn it off and then back on again.)

With my Measure Rest shape, a Measure Rest width setting of 360 EVPUs is
plenty to leave room for clef changes. 320 is borderline, and anything less
is always a collision. Experiment with yours to acheive the right mix.

Robert
----------
From: owner-finale
To: finale
Subject: Question re block rests and clefs
Date: Thursday, January 19, 1995 1:51PM

I'll try this again. I'll just plunge in here and ask a question that will
make clear what a novice I am. I use Finale 3.2 on the Mac (and, yes, I
have called for 3.2.1 which was courteously granted.)

Please forgive the relatively mundane nature of this question, but can
someone tell me how to avoid collision between a clef change and a block
rest. Writing cello orchestral parts this is a common issue for me. Often
before a block rest the part will be written in bass clef, while after the
rest the part will be in tenor or treble clef. I've been using breaks in
block rests to create a single measure rest that I can adjust in part
extraction to a size that accomodates the clef and the block rest symbol.
(It looks ridiculous, but gets the message across, and I have not gotten to
the point of wishing to publish any material.) Or must I make sure the
clef change is noted before the block rest. This isn't the case in most
published material I've encountered.

Chris Werner, former bank teller, band director, pediatric cardiologist
and father.

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:54:30 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:47:19 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Is Finale 3.x for Windows Any Good?

I've run into some hassle with clefs and slurs and the clipboard.
See my earlier post.
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:02:45 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 14:03:13 -0800 (PST)
From: LAMONT DOWNS <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Question re block rests and clefs
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


On Thu, 19 Jan 1995, John C. Werner wrote:

> Please forgive the relatively mundane nature of this question, but can
> someone tell me how to avoid collision between a clef change and a block
> rest. Writing cello orchestral parts this is a common issue for me. Often

An alternative way to solving this, other than adjusting the measure
width, is to adjust the actual shape selected for block rests, narrowing
it from each end. The good side of this is that you can avoid the
clef/rest collisions you mention without adding unnecessary rests;
the downside is that you will globally affect all rests in the part.
My own experience with printed music is that block rests vary rather
widely in any case, so I don't mind the slight bit of extra space between
either end of the block rest and the barlines.

Lamont Downs
[email protected]
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:02:17 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:59:38 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale Bug (fwd)

Coda 800-843-2066
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:24:14 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:24:37 -0600
From: [email protected] (Richard K. Jones)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: subscribe

subscribe
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 22:09:56 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:39:29 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected] (Robert P. Salzman (Monument Mt. RHS))
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Unsubscribe
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]


I would like to read your BB and select particular articles or threads to
read. I tried FTP to your address and got the message "not connected". Any
suggestions?

Thanks, Bob
--

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 23:28:05 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <v01510100ab44fa1778c7@[134.84.101.172]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 23:28:57 -0600
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Mark D. Henderson)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Finale PC problems

<My partner uses Finale PC version 3.0 and has been having all kinds of
spacing problems with this version. In particular, and measures that have
been converted to slash notation (usually just quarter notes originally)
will not accommodate spacing (either note or beat). They continually come
out way to wide and have to be manually positioned. On a big lead sheet for
rhythm players, this is a major pain. I use the Mac version, so I was no
help, but told him I would query all your bright minds.>

Forgive me for sending this again, but it tool several days for me to start
getting the mail correctly,... so if anyone had an idea about this problem,
please repost your suggestions or e-mail me directly.

Mark D. Henderson //..."it don't mean a thing
[email protected] // if it ain't got that swing"
Universtiy of Minnesota
-Duke Ellington

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 06:56:53 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 07:54:18 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a good copyist

Randolph Peters writes:

>>You raise some real concerns, but I don't think that Finale settings, as
intricate as they may be, constitute a protected trade secret. The
promotion of high engraving/copying standards is a wiser and more lucrative
business strategy than trying to protect your corner of the turf. You could
be seen as good source and educator about copying and engraving standards.
That would probably increase the demand for your services rather than
diminish them.<<
--------
Randolph,

Hmm. Well, there's obviously not a single answer to this. Since I make 100%
of my income using Finale to copy music (font hobby aside), I may be a bit
protective of specific "tricks" that might give myself or those I work with
an edge over our moderate, but increasingly qualified competition. These
tricks, whether you consider them "secrets" or not, are at least one integral
reason why people call us, rather than a competitor, for a job. With music
prep being a slowly shrinking market and computers becoming more
sophisticated each year, being protective seems, for us (for now), prudent.

Just think. When Finale was introduced, the whole idea of it was to ELIMINATE
the need for copyists/engravers! Remember the ads? How using Finale would
give any composer "professional looking parts and scores?" Well, it hasn't
happened thanks to the complexity of getting music properly onto paper,
Finale's daunting learning curve, and the limitations of technology. Finale's
creation has even provided new niches of work for the computer-savvy, which
if you ask me is turf worth protecting.

Despite all this, I understand where you're coming from. If I worked in
academia, I might be singing a different tune myself.

Don Rice - Brooklyn
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:55:41 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab458bef0502100484d4@[158.135.73.248]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:55:57 -0600
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Henry Howey)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a good copyist

>Just think. When Finale was introduced, the whole idea of it was to ELIMINATE
>the need for copyists/engravers! Remember the ads? How using Finale would
>give any composer "professional looking parts and scores?" Well, it hasn't
>happened thanks to the complexity of getting music properly onto paper,
>Finale's daunting learning curve, and the limitations of technology. Finale's
>creation has even provided new niches of work for the computer-savvy, which
>if you ask me is turf worth protecting.
>
>Despite all this, I understand where you're coming from. If I worked in
>academia, I might be singing a different tune myself.
>
>Don Rice - Brooklyn

This is the crux of the whole situation. Finale's great strength is its
flexibility. SCORE, on the other hand has fixed rules which actually make
its mastery simpler. I like Finale's capability to manipulate the music I
have put in. The process of making quality scores and parts can be tiring,
but Finale is a tool whose limits must be learned. I believe Don could
make a considerable sum by getting EVS to commission him to write a book on
"tweaking" Finale for the best results.



Henry Howey
Professor
Department of Music
Sam Houston State University
Huntsville, TX 77341
[email protected]
FAX (409) 294-3765
W (409) 294-1364
H (409) 291-0626
Owner of FINALE Discussion List





================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 13:39:29 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 20 Jan 95 11:30:10 pst
From: "Blake Hodgetts" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Multiple-line staff names

This was posted some months ago, but I'm new to the list and reading the
archives, and I haven't seen a solution posted...

>While I'm at it, I have another question. Since I work mainly as a copyist
>for a composer and arranger of choral music, I often work with SATB scores.
>The composer's preference is to have the staves labelled with the letters
>SA and TB, but arranged vertically, so:
>
>S
>A
>
>T
>B
>
>Currently, I am making each one of these letters a separate note expression and
>put them wherever required, lining them up by hand. This strikes me as a
>rather inelegant solution (and a time-consuming one, of course!); it further
>strikes me that there is probably a much simpler solution to this problem,
>which is probably a very common one. What I'm looking for, I suppose, is
>a way to have a multiple-line staff name automatically affixed to the staff,
>but I don't seem to be able to find a way to do this.

How about making a dummy staff with zero staff lines and no display of rests,
expressions, etc., but with a staff name that represents the second line
desired, with the proper vertical offset? This staff can then be superimposed on
the "real" staff, with the result that both lines will be displayed on every
system in the piece.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Blake Hodgetts / "Life is the only *
Musician / thing we have * [email protected]
Eugene, Oregon / worth living" *
(Opinions represented above are mine, not my employer's)
-----------------------------------------------------------

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 14:08:16 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 15:08:46 -0500
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (David Froom)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Multiple-line staff names

>>While I'm at it, I have another question. Since I work mainly as a copyist
>>for a composer and arranger of choral music, I often work with SATB scores.
>>The composer's preference is to have the staves labelled with the letters
>>SA and TB, but arranged vertically, so:
>>
>>S
>>A
>>
>>T
>>B
>>
>>Currently, I am making each one of these letters a separate note expression
>>and
>>put them wherever required, lining them up by hand. This strikes me as a
>>rather inelegant solution (and a time-consuming one, of course!); it further
>>strikes me that there is probably a much simpler solution to this problem,
>>which is probably a very common one. What I'm looking for, I suppose, is
>>a way to have a multiple-line staff name automatically affixed to the staff,
>>but I don't seem to be able to find a way to do this.
>
>How about making a dummy staff with zero staff lines and no display of rests,
>expressions, etc., but with a staff name that represents the second line
>desired, with the proper vertical offset? This staff can then be superimposed
>on
>the "real" staff, with the result that both lines will be displayed on every
>system in the piece.

A middle-ground solution -- not as much initial set up work, but a little
more work on the page layout -- would be to make a text block. After the
text block is created (which could be a single one, since you can do
returns and have left alignment), it can be put onto each staff in page
layout with a double-click and entering the correct ID number.

David Froom - [email protected]
Music Department
St. Mary's College of Maryland
St. Mary's City, Maryland

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:44:39 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 11:44:14 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu (John C. Werner)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: RE: Question re block rests and clefs

Thanks for the answer regarding rests and clefs. Won't it be great space
will be alloted for clefs within and at the end of measures within standard
use of the program. I spend quite a bit of time manually placing notes in
measures where there are clef changes. Any other solutions? Thanks again.

Chris Werner, pediatric cardiologist, Brown University
music lover, father, clarinetist, singer, Medical School
accompanist, and former bank teller. Providence, RI

John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:35:51 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a good copyist
From: [email protected] (Ana Kellia Ramares)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 95 11:56:06 PST

[email protected] (Henry Howey) writes:

> >Just think. When Finale was introduced, the whole idea of it was to ELIMINAT
> >the need for copyists/engravers! Remember the ads? How using Finale would
> >give any composer "professional looking parts and scores?" Well, it hasn't
> >happened thanks to the complexity of getting music properly onto paper,
> >Finale's daunting learning curve, and the limitations of technology. Finale'
> >creation has even provided new niches of work for the computer-savvy, which
> >if you ask me is turf worth protecting.
> >

Except now we have font designers who have copyright to their artwork and
engravers who want copyright over the look and feel of their years of
tweaking Finale, adding layers of expense when it is already damned hard
enough and expensive enough to get performances of new music together.

Kellia
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:07:43 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:08:15 -0700 (MST)
From: Mark Basinski - UA School of Music <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a good copyist
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Ana Kellia Ramares writes:

>Except now we have font designers who have copyright to their artwork and
>engravers who want copyright over the look and feel of their years of
>tweaking Finale, adding layers of expense when it is already damned hard
>enough and expensive enough to get performances of new music together.

I'm not quite sure what to make of this - are you saying that you don't think
that "font designers who have copyright to their artwork" should be able to do
so? I think that is also a low blow - let's face it Kellia, everyone on this
list can tell you're referring to Don Rice and his Golden Age fonts with that
remark. I think that is a really stupid thing to say, especially in this forum.
As far as those fonts go, nobody has to buy them unless they want to, and some
clients want that kind of look, and will prefer a typesetter who can provide
it. What is your problem with that?

As for whining about "adding layers of expense" etc. can you give us a
concrete example that *you* know of where this has added layers of expense? Or
are you just shooting off your mouth again? The only instances I know of
involving Finale and new music are ones where the ONLY WAY that a new piece
could POSSIBLY be presented was because the composer had taken the time and
sweat to learn Finale, and could thus prepare his own scores and parts.

As far as preparing new music for performance via paying someone to do so, I
myself can't give you a comparison, but I can't see where a copyist preferring
to provide print or PostScript files to the client (and not turning over the
finale files) would add ANY cost to the process.

Please consider what you are saying before posting such nonsense!

Mark Basinski University of Arizona
Adjunct Assistant Professor School of Music

[email protected] (602) 621-7470

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:37:46 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:38:22 -0600
Message-ID: <ab46e8a800021004d08d@[131.151.27.58]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (douglas stotter)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: FIN/MAC: Cakewalk files

Does anyone know how to import cakewalk (.WRK) files into finale or how to
convert them to .MID or MIDI files (which I can then import)?

Thanks


////////////////////////////////////////////
// //
// Douglas Stotter //
// Director of Bands //
// 132 Castleman Hall //
// University of Missouri-Rolla //
// Rolla, MO 65401 //
// (314) 341-4698 //
// [email protected] //
// //
////////////////////////////////////////////

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 17:27:22 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:27:58 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Michael O'Connor)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: fonts

Can any one point me to a source for specialized fonts for finale3/win? I'm
mostly interested in fonts for early music. The fonts that finale provides
are quite inadequate. Thanks.

Mike

*****************************
Michael O'Connor
[email protected]
Florida State University
*****************************

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:19:27 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:15:53 -0600 (CST)
From: Brian J Campbell <brianjc@jove.acs.unt.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale Mail-list <[email protected]>
Subject: Finale 3.2 updater
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950121181439.15742A-100000@jove.acs.unt.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

For anyone who hasn't gotten this yet, I have uploaded a copy to
fttp://ftp.unt.edu. It should be appearing in the /pub/micro/mac directory
early next week!

Brian Campbell
/----------------\
|-----------------------------------|----------------------------------------|
|STUCK at UNT Department of Music |INTERNET: brianjc@jove.acs.unt.edu |
|in lovely Denton, Texas, USA |Snail:526 Alegre Vista;Denton, TX 76205 |
|Jazz/Arranging/Comp/Saxophone/Winds|Voice: (817) 382-7131 |
|-----------(It's not a town, just an Incredible Simulation)-----------------|
\__________________________________________________________________/

A Hypothetical Paradox:
Who would win in a battle between the red-shirted members of an
Enterprise security team, who always die in the first five minutes of an
episode, and a legion of Imperial Stormtroopers, who can't hit the broad
side of a planet?

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:34:57 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:31:24 -0600 (CST)
From: Dorothy Kaye Keyser <dkeyser@jove.acs.unt.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
CC: [email protected]
Subject: Re: fonts
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950121182952.16573A-100000@jove.acs.unt.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Could anybody who responds to this post either do it on the discussion
list or send me a copy too? Thanks. (And thanks, Michael)

On Sat, 21 Jan 1995, Michael O'Connor wrote:

> Can any one point me to a source for specialized fonts for finale3/win? I'm
> mostly interested in fonts for early music. The fonts that finale provides
> are quite inadequate. Thanks.
>
> Mike
>
> *****************************
> Michael O'Connor
> [email protected]
> Florida State University
> *****************************
>

Dorothy Keyser Medievalist
College of Music, University of North Texas
email: dkeyser@jove.acs.unt.edu
<<A paradox is just the truth standing on its head to get attention.>>

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 19:14:39 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 20:07:23 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: FIN/MAC: Cakewalk files

Cakewalk will save anything as a .MID file. Just import it directly into
FINALE. Make sure to set the quantization as you want it beforehand.
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 21:28:05 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 21:28:40 -0600
Message-ID: <ab472c9901021004c741@[131.151.27.58]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (douglas stotter)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: FIN/MAC: Cakewalk files

At 1:07 AM 1/22/95, [email protected] wrote:
>Cakewalk will save anything as a .MID file. Just import it directly into
>FINALE. Make sure to set the quantization as you want it beforehand.

Sorry I didn't explain my situation better. I do not own Cakewalk, but have
downloaded some from the net in the form of .WRK files. I am working on a
MAC, so the DOS utilities for converting .WRK to .MID are of no use. I need
a MAC utility.

Thanks


////////////////////////////////////////////
// //
// Douglas Stotter //
// Director of Bands //
// 132 Castleman Hall //
// University of Missouri-Rolla //
// Rolla, MO 65401 //
// (314) 341-4698 //
// [email protected] //
// //
////////////////////////////////////////////

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 22:52:40 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 20:53:11 -0800 (PST)
From: Charles Nagel <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: finale <[email protected]>
Subject: early music problems
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I noticed a number of other people were interested in early-music fonts,
so I'm encouraged to ask a couple questions that perhaps other EM editors
may be able to answer:
Has anyone figured out a reasonably effective way do do incipits?
Has anyone found an *easy* way to insert a g-clef with "8" superscript
(as one would use for soprano recorder parts)? The Petrucci font does
have the clef (shift-option-T), but I've never figured out how to get it
into the score. (It seems an odd omission in the program.)

Many thanks. I've learned much from reading the discussions in this list
and appreciate the thought that people put into their responses.

Charlie Nagel
Vashon Island, WA
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 02:39:20 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 03:40:41 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: RE: Re:stuff to customize

R. Patterson writes:

>>To prove that I, at least, put my "money" where my mouth is, I will mention

that several months ago I posted a file to this list in uuencoded format. It
contained all my pre-v3.2 settings. I don't know if it is still out there in
a digest or not. If there is interest I will repost it. Heck, I can just
post the ETF straight up, since ETF's are nothing but text anyway.<<

Robert, while I appreciate your point of view and contribution on this
subject - you still don't get it. Most of us have our settings and keen eye
for "punctuation" intact. We are not the ones interested in yours or
anothers' Finale settings or files.

The protection issue concerns those who lack the knowledge of fine engraving
rules but who OWN Finale. As you know there are many who makeup this
demographic. I am sure you are also aware of the proliferation of poorly
engraved publications of which there are also many. The standards for music
publication has been brought to its knees by the availability of notation
software and the eagerness of the fledgling amateur to do the grunt work.
Herein lies the threat to the professional engraver/copyist. In many areas of
publication, the people running the production end don't have a clue. They
are interested only in the timeline of the project and the bottom line. Any
Finale file prepared by a knowledgable engraver, used, after deleting the
entries, could look immeasurably better than the amatuers' work without
effort. It will not look perfect as the essential manual spacing steps, tie
adjustments, etc. would not be done. However, it would be a bold improvement
over Finales' default settings and the creator of those special settings
would not benefit from their work. Period.

A case in point:
I was contracted for a project by a company in Cinncinati a couple of years
ago that was unhappy with the work of their current engraver. I did some some
samples for them and they were pleased. We negotiated for a higher figure
than they had been paying previously because they felt the quality was higher
and they wanted my business. Since this project was still somewhat new, they
were not set in the complete format for their books. They asked if I couldn't
send them the template I had created so they could play with different fonts
and such. I said no and told them why. After a lengthy discussion they
assured me that they planned only to use my template only as discussed. They
wore me down and I finally agreed and sent it to them. GUESS WHAT? I never
heard from them again, they won't return my calls, and they are still
cranking out these books and secured a distribution deal with one of the
world's largest publishing houses. (I know this because I do work for this
publisher).

So, yes, I got burned and I'll get over it - but the point remains that the
competition is building with every software update that comes closer to true
engraving standards (yes we're still far from it) and your "signature" is the
quality of your work. Much of the quality control is contained in our files
and providing that to the client is far beyond the job description! We get
steady work because we have the "tools" for the job. Giving even some of our
tools away is de-valuing our services and, ultimately, reducing our
employment opportunities ($$). I am not prepared to take that risk.

John Blane
Blane Music Preparation
Chicago, IL 60607
(312) 455-1100
(312) 455-1162 Fax
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 08:35:37 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 07:36:10 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: early music problems
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Sat, 21 Jan 1995, Charles Nagel wrote:

> Has anyone figured out a reasonably effective way do do incipits?

Yes. I used to do incipits in Freehand with an eps of the first page and
an eps of the incipit until I developed the following technique. I now do
incipits by creating a double system for the work. For the sake of
example let's assume an SATB score. Therefore the top four staves are the
real ones with the music entered on them. Leave the first measure blank
and number the measures beginning with the second measure offset to 0
(hence making it measure 1) I create a staff view to avoid viewing the
bottom systems when entering the music. After the music and text is
entered I then go to page view and optimize. By manually optimizing the
first system to show only the *bottom* four staves I then retain complete
control over the appearance of this system. I turn off the clefs and
whatever else I want to get rid of, create a note in each measure with
the notehead set to the blank character and the stem set to a blank shape
and use this character to attach my old clefs. The old clefs are created
in the shape designer tool. To get this system to appear along side of
the first system, after spacing the rest of the systems I turn off Avoid
Margin Collisions and play with the spacing until I have the first system
(the incipit) and the second system (The first music system) lined up as
desired. From this description you might guess that I have a template
with the incipit system set up the way I want which I use rather than
start from scratch every time. I also have several libraries with old
clefs which I have designed in the shape designer ready to load.

> Has anyone found an *easy* way to insert a g-clef with "8" superscript
> (as one would use for soprano recorder parts)? The Petrucci font does
> have the clef (shift-option-T), but I've never figured out how to get it
> into the score. (It seems an odd omission in the program.)

This is an example of not taking the manual up to bed for a 10 minute
bedtime reading session. (Just a little joke as my wife thinks I'm
perverted for this little habit of mine.) As we say on the list RTFM
under the clef designer. I just went to the clef designer and subsituted
this clef for one which I was not using. It is then available under the
clef choices everywhere in the program.

*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 08:55:35 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 07:56:10 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: RE: Re:stuff to customize
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Sun, 22 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:
> anothers' Finale settings or files.

> The protection issue concerns those who lack the knowledge of fine engraving
> rules but who OWN Finale. As you know there are many who makeup this
> demographic. I am sure you are also aware of the proliferation of poorly
> engraved publications of which there are also many. The standards for music
> publication has been brought to its knees by the availability of notation
> software and the eagerness of the fledgling amateur to do the grunt work.

Interesting point. I share your concern but are the major players in music
publication really buying the work of rank amateurs with little experience
and no concept of punctuation, John? To get some historical perspective I
will share the words of Cecil Effinger who invented the first practical
musical typewriter in 1955 and manufactured and distributed the machine
from then until his death in 1990. (I wrote his biography for my diss.)

". . . with two or three weeks of practice professional copyists can equal
or surpass the speed of work done by hand. Far from putting the copyist
out of business, . . . the Musicwriter will open a new field for
specialists, just as the typewriter developed the stenographer. One can
only shudder at the thought of beautiful but meaningless designs that
could be put on paper and palmed off for music. The Musicwriter in
unprincipled hands might well set off a music explosion that would at last
completely obliterate the already blunted hearing faculties of the human
race."

Sound familiar? My perspective is that the human race has not only
retained its ability to hear, but, judging from the music students which I
see at the institutional level, it has developed a new understanding of
hearing. (Global perspective for one) I think that we should have faith
in the human race. How else are we to persevere in the face of sometimes
discouraging circumstances?

The last word is that I share your concerns and have lost several
contracts to people who do lower quality work (after sharing my templates
with the publishers). Hence back to my original statement. I charge for
my templates. Period.

(It just occurred to me that sharing my professional secrets [see incipits
which I just spent 20 minutes writing] on this forum is perhaps
proliferating the lower quality work of which you speak with no hope of
remuneration. In considering this John, I will only consider that my
replies are directed to you and others from whom I have also learned much
(Gil, Don, Mark, Henry, and the list goes on and on . . .). [This
philosophical musing is getting me too unfocused so I guess I'll return to
work.])
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************
PS: A commercial plug - My bio of Effinger (a prolific composer as well)
is due out this year from Scarecrow Press.

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 10:49:51 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 11:50:27 -0500
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (David Froom)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a good copyist

>Except now we have font designers who have copyright to their artwork and
>engravers who want copyright over the look and feel of their years of
>tweaking Finale, adding layers of expense when it is already damned hard
>enough and expensive enough to get performances of new music together.
>
>Kellia

I feel compelled to add my 2=A2 as a composer here. Sure there is trouble
and expense in getting performances. I don't think, however, that one
should denigrate anyone's contribution. Should composers not receive
royalties or commissions because of the trouble and expense performers have
in playing new music? Should performers be asked to play for free because
of the trouble and expense concert producers incur? Whenever I (or my
wife, who is an accomplished performer specializing in new music) are asked
to contribute our services, I want to know -- besides the details about
the cause involved -- who else is contributing: printer of programs? owner
of the hall? piano tuner? ushers? recording engineer? Why should anyone
be singled out as the one not to be compensated fairly? To exploit anyone
(which happens usually to those most vunerable to exploitation) is
unscrupulous.

The reason we learn Finale as composers is usually that we believe we will
find it less expensive in the long run to do the work ourselves. Depending
on how much you are able to earn doing other things, and how serious you
are about doing quality copying, this may not turn out to be true. The
reason we continue to use it is that either we have the time to do the
copying, can't afford to hire someone, or take some pleasure in doing the
work. For me personally, I like the sense of control I have when I copy my
own scores and take great pleasure in the final product. I don't, however,
like the work enough to copy anyone elses music.

As we find out from doing the work, it is demanding and, especially if you
care about how things look, requires more than a bit of research. My
appreciation of the work of good professional copyists is very high. The
best people in this field are artists. The value of their work is
understood by performers who save hours by not having the look of the score
add time to their learning the music; also by everyone else reading the
score, who consciously or not will have considerable pleasure added to the
experience simply because they are looking at something that is beautiful.

It strikes me as ungracious to question the integrity of people we are
getting free and excellent advice from. I am particularly grateful to the
professionals who participate in this list. Thanks for all of your advice.
Those of you who are trying to advance the art deserve to be paid for your
efforts. In the long run, we all benefit when you succeed in raising
standards.

David Froom - [email protected]
Music Department
St. Mary's College of Maryland
St. Mary's City, Maryland

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 12:36:09 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 13:36:41 -0500
From: "Myron Bennett" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Interesting press release

I found the following in the Usenet group, rec.music.compose, and thought
it might interest this list (assuming someone else hasn't already uploaded
it.)

For your interest, here's the press release:

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

For more information contact:

Chris Newell, President Cindy Grande, President
Musitek, Inc. Grande Software, Inc.
NIF Administrative Coordinator NIF Technical Coordinator

(805) 646-8051 (206) 244-3411
410 Bryant Circle, Suite K 19004 37th Avenue South
Ojai, CA 93023 Seattle, WA 98188

NEW MUSIC NOTATION
STANDARD FILE FORMAT

ANAHEIM, CA -- January 21, 1995 -- An exciting new development in the area
of music desktop publishing is now coming to fruition after months of
work: a standard file format for musical notation.

Computer musicians have long needed a notational equivalent to standard
MIDI files, to transfer scores between various editing/publishing
programs, and from music scanning software into notation editors. Like
standard MIDI files, such a format would allow users to move existing
files between products according to their evolving needs, without
substantial loss of data.

The new format is currently code named "NIF" (Notation Interchange
Format). Sponsored by Passport Designs and Coda Music Technology, NIF has
had and continues to have major input from a large, diverse group of
notation software designers, as well as researchers in the areas of music
recognition, musicology and computer science, expert users and music
publishers. NIF's exceptionally thorough design is the product of a
lengthy consensus-building process between these participants. It is a
non-proprietary format, and will be available with no licensing fees
whatsoever to anyone who wants it.

The NIF project is now moving into the testing stage. Several companies
are scheduled to begin trial implementation shortly, to be followed by
others once the format stabilizes.

The following companies and individuals have been active participants in
the NIF project:

The NIF project was funded jointly by Coda Music Technology and Passport
Designs. Individual members of the original working group include:

Nicholas Carter, University of Surrey
Cindy Grande, Grande Software
Wladek Homenda, Musitek
Steve Keller, Passport Designs
Lowell Levinger, Passport Designs
Chris Newell, Musitek
Mike Ost, Passport Designs
Leland Smith, San Andreas Press
Randall Stokes, Coda Music Technology

Advisory Board:

Dave Abrahams, Mark of the Unicorn
Gary Barber, Temporal Acuity Products
Alan Belkin, University of Montreal
Raymond Bily, Midisoft Corporation
Mike Brockman, Temporal Acuity Products
Don Byrd, Advanced Music Notation Systems, Inc., Temporal Acuity Products
John Cerullo, Hal Leonard Corporation
Daniel Dorff, Theodore Presser
John Forbes, Boosey & Hawkes
Tom Hall, A-R Editions
Greg Hendershott, Twelve Tone Systems
William Holab, G. Schirmer
Tom Johns, Hal Leonard Corporation
Severo Ornstein, Woodside, California
Norman Reid, San Francisco, California
Robert Schuneman, E. C. Schirmer
Dave Scoggin, Opcode Systems
Eleanor Selfridge-Field, Center for Computer Assisted Research in the
Humanities
Don Williams, Opcode Systems

Technical Coordinator:

Cindy Grande

Administrative Coordinator:

Chris Newell

Special Advisor:

Alan Belkin

-- END --
**********************
Myron Bennett [email protected]
or [email protected]
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 14:13:46 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 14:52:43 -0500 (EST)
From: Kevin M Sawicke <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a good copyist
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9501221405.B25559-0100000@grog>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


______________________________________________________________________________
Kevin M Sawicke / Western Michigan University
Music Theatre Performance, College of Fine Arts
219 Smith Burnham Hall / Kalamazoo, MI 49008-1041
email: [email protected] -- ph: 616.387.1218
______________________________________________________________________________
"Listen as your day unfolds, challenge what the future holds.
Always keep your head up to the sky." -- Des'ree

On Sat, 21 Jan 1995, Mark Basinski - UA School of Music wrote:

> As for whining about "adding layers of expense" etc. can you give us a
> concrete example that *you* know of where this has added layers of expense? Or
> are you just shooting off your mouth again? The only instances I know of
[SNIP]
>
> Please consider what you are saying before posting such nonsense!
[SNIP]

I am far from being a professional copyist. I enjoy reading the
information that everyone discusses here about Finale and music notation.
I originally bought Finale a couple of years ago because the first song I
tried to manuscript took me something like ten hours. I thought this was
nonsense. Little did I know that Finale was such a powerful program, that
it would probably take me longer, at least for awhile, to master notation
and be able to do it quickly. Even better, it helps me to write music and
hear it right away. I can mess around with arpeggiations and different
chords with a couple of clicks on the mouse. It's invaluable to me as a
composer.

My intention is not to do engraving work with it, but to make some pretty
darn good looking sheet music for what I write. I have learned immense
things from discussion here, but I find it childish that you would say
that anyone's viewpoints are nonsense! We all have varying degrees of
composing experience...I didn't know the first thing about what engravers
did before this discussion exploded, and I find it interesting...but that
wouldn't stop me from giving my own opinion on it.

We're here to learn from each other and keep alive the joy of writing music.


______________________________________________________________________________
Kevin M Sawicke / Western Michigan University
Music Theatre Performance, College of Fine Arts
219 Smith Burnham Hall / Kalamazoo, MI 49008-1041
email: [email protected] -- ph: 616.387.1218
______________________________________________________________________________
"Listen as your day unfolds, challenge what the future holds.
Always keep your head up to the sky." -- Des'ree
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 14:27:38 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, Jan 22, 1995 2:29 PM
From: Alice Brin Renken <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: early music problems
To: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], Alice Brin Renken <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

In message Charles Nagel writes:
> I noticed a number of other people were interested in early-music fonts,
> so I'm encouraged to ask a couple questions that perhaps other EM editors
> may be able to answer:
> Has anyone figured out a reasonably effective way do do incipits?
> Has anyone found an *easy* way to insert a g-clef with "8" superscript
> (as one would use for soprano recorder parts)? The Petrucci font does
> have the clef (shift-option-T), but I've never figured out how to get it
> into the score. (It seems an odd omission in the program.)
>
> Many thanks. I've learned much from reading the discussions in this list
> and appreciate the thought that people put into their responses.
>
> Charlie Nagel

Finale for Mac 3.0 and 3.2 have the treble-eight clef in the clef menu. You can
choose it just as you would choose any of the others. For the incipits, I
haven't figured that one out yet. I think it would need to be a separate file
that you paste in later.

-- @
-- ||
-- ||
-- Alice Renken ||
-- ( )
-- "Look, Ma, no end-pin!" ><
-- <( )>
-- _\ /_
-- [email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 17:03:10 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 18:03:41 -0500 (EST)
From: "David W. Fenton" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
CC: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a Copyist
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Let me first say that as a freelance computer consultant/musicologist I
agree that an engraver has the right to retain his own tweaking of Finale
for his/her own use.

However, in the heat of the discussion, It seems to me that there are two
points being overlooked.

1. Why are the Finale defaults so distant from professional engraving
standards? Shouldn't the manufacturer provide us with a set of default
parameters which meet minimal professional standards? Of course, everyone
has individual preferences, and there are a number of perfectly acceptable
_different_ engraving styles. Word processing programs provide such
templates, but the ones we get from Finale and the default libraries are
(IMO) of little use to anyone. I believe that, overall, Coda has done a
very poor job of implementing templates. They should look at Word for
Windows 6 to see how templates ought to be implemented (choice of
cascading updates to documents when the template is changed, styles,
styles based on other styles, choice of templates each time you open a new
file, program configuration parameters stored in INI files and formatting
options in the templates, etc.).

Basically, I think that the amount of sweat equity we all have to invest
in getting Finale to look acceptable is due almost entirely to Finale's
lack of attention to providing us with proper defaults which represent
recognized professional standards. Is this really too much to ask?

2. Although we are now seeing poorly laid out, but beautifully printed
scores being published (i.e., non-professionals using SCORE and FINALE to
produce camera-ready copy or PS files for publication), aren't we
forgetting that the alternative used to be the same, except done by hand?
For musicologists, these programs are ideal. I am writing a dissertation
on the piano quartet and quintet in Vienna and I would die if I had to
score up all these pieces by hand. I can (relatively) easily produce
something that performers can play from, whether it meets professional
engraving standards or not. However, it will be MUCH more readable than
anything I could score up by hand. Just look at the Garland Press series
of 18th- and 19th-century symphonies. To keep costs down, they didn't
engrave anything. Instead they used copies of the editors' hand-copied
scores. The result is everything but disastrous. If Garland were
publishing it today, I'm sure it would be done in Finale or Score, and the
result would be vastly superior even if the engravor's were NOT
professionals.

Thanks for listening to my 2 cents.

David W. Fenton
New York University
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 17:20:03 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 18:20:17 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], Alice Brin Renken <[email protected]>
From: [email protected] (Michael O'Connor)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: early music problems

So is it a baroque 'cello or a gamba?


>
>-- @
>-- ||
>-- ||
>-- Alice Renken ||
>-- ( )
>-- "Look, Ma, no end-pin!" ><
>-- <( )>
>-- _\ /_
>--
>

Mike

*****************************
Michael O'Connor
[email protected]
Florida State University
*****************************

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 20:44:27 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 21:46:17 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: American Soc of Music Copyists

FYI

American Society of Music Copyists
P.O. Box 2557
Times Square Station
New York, NY 10108 USA
---------

I forget who asked about copying rates, but I remember promising someone that
I'd post the address of the American Society of Music Copyists (ASMC).

The ASMC is a group of professional copyists that has been around since (I
think) the '50's. The official function (besides being a community of peers)
is to make pricing recommendations to negotiating parties of the AFM and
local 802 in New York City. The society publishes yearly scale and
rate-sheets that get sent to members, as well as a directory. Dues? $35/yr

Anyway, I hope this helps.

Don Rice - Brooklyn
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 20:45:41 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 21:43:06 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Back in 2 wks

All,

I'm gonna miss the action here, but we're off to Washington D.C. for two
weeks as the Broadway bound revival of "How To Succeed In Business Without
Really Trying" gets a shakedown at Kennedy Center.

Four copyists using Finale 2.6.3 on Macs are assigned (I'm working this job
for Miller Music Service, which is doing the music prep). The show has been
entirely reorchestrated by Danny Troob, who did the beautiful charts for
"Beauty & the Beast." We expect it to be quite an intense trip, esp. the few
days before the 1st orchestra reading next weekend.

Why use FinMac 2.6.3 for a job like this? It redraws twice as fast as Finale
3.x. and doesn't need debugging, which we really appreciate when crunch time
comes.

Back in 2 wks with a few more gray hairs and a thicker wallet.

Don Rice - Brooklyn
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 08:18:56 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 95 09:19:23 EST
From: [email protected] (Deanna Light)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: 3.0.1 Updater?

Sorry if this has been covered ad nauseam, but is there an FTP site for
the Windows 3.0.1 updater? If not, how can I acquire a copy?

TIA.

Deanna Light
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 08:35:12 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 95 09:35:41 EST
From: [email protected] (Deanna Light)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: An Amateur Asks About Advice
CC:

(how's that for assonance? and this early in the morning!) ;)

As one of those "rank amateurs" who is trying to learn to use Finale
to produce the best-looking output I can, I must say that I greatly appreciate
the willingness of the members of the list to share their hard-earned
knowledge -- and to answer the often quite basic questions that we
amateurs find ourselves stumped by.

I must also say that one of the greatest feelings in the world is when
you can finally wrestle what you want out of Finale -- when you have learned
its little rules, its little exceptions, its little quirks well enough to
make it do exactly what you want. The problem, of course, is developing
one's eye enough to *know* exactly what one wants.

Now my question: as an amateur, I am only beginning to develop an eye
for truly aesthetic layout, design, typology. I have recently acquired
a copy of TEACH YOURSELF THE ART OF MUSIC ENGRAVING AND PROCESSING (and I
probably have the title wrong, I know), and it is making lovely bedtime
reading (geeks of the world, unite!). But here's my question: can some
of the experts on the list point me to some published output that was
done on Finale -- and that you regard as some of the higher quality work
done with the software -- so that I can better develop my eye? What,
in your opinion, is some of the best that Finale has produced? And,
conversely, what is some of the worst?

I have access to the library of the University of Georgia, so I at least
have access to a not inconsiderable number of scores of various types.
Any advice is appreciated. My main interest is choral music, but I have
done some work with orchestral scores, as well. I'd be interested in
anything you have to recommend.

One addtional point: so as not to clutter the list, you might respond
to me personally (see address below). I'll post a compiled response
to the list after I get some responses.


Thanks in advance, as usual.

Deanna Light
University of Georgia Department of English
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 09:20:55 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 95 10:19:11 EST
From: "TBQ Press" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: 3.0.1 Updater?

Only place I could find was Code at 1-800-843-2066 (its 3.0.2). Free, but
hav your serial number ready...
Paul
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 09:21:02 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 95 10:20:38 EST
From: [email protected] (Rich Rinehart)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: FIN/MAC: Cakewalk files

>At 1:07 AM 1/22/95, [email protected] wrote:
>>Cakewalk will save anything as a .MID file. Just import it directly into
>>FINALE. Make sure to set the quantization as you want it beforehand.
>
>Sorry I didn't explain my situation better. I do not own Cakewalk, but have
>downloaded some from the net in the form of .WRK files. I am working on a
>MAC, so the DOS utilities for converting .WRK to .MID are of no use. I need
>a MAC utility.
>
>Thanks
>// Douglas Stotter //

Then you're out of luck I believe. Maybe you can find someone who has cakewalk.
If you get the files to me I could do it for you (non electronic mail).
-rich

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rich Rinehart | phone: 216-433-5211
NASA Lewis Research Center | email: [email protected]
Cleveland, OH | http://warhol.lerc.nasa.gov/rich.html
"Best damn mail handler I every had"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 11:13:31 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 12:15:22 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Value of a good anything

I find this whole debate regarding whether a John Blane or Don Rice should
give the files to the individual commissioning the work rather ludicrous!
When I hand over a DAT cassette to a client who has commissioned music from
me for a video they're producing, it's understood that he/she can use *that*
music again in any way they want - just like the PS files or printed sheets a
copyist hands over. But giving over the Finale files is akin to giving the
producer my synthesizers/digital multitrack/computer setup.

I find it funny that the computer literate who disagree with John or Don on
this file matter probably do so because of the fact that, since you can't
hold a "Finale file setting" in your hand, they have little or no value -
unlike my sythesizers. WRONG!! This is just *another* example of people's
misunderstanding of software. The type of understanding that hurts *everyone*
via software piracy or the very matters that the pro copyists who contribute
to this list have mentioned.

Jeff Harrison
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 11:57:09 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 95 12:46:01 EST
From: Rob Burns <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Layout of Mirrored measures
To: [email protected]

The other day I was trying out mirroring as a way to save time when
a piece with repeated sections. It was a guitar arrangement of a popular
tune on 1 stave. I mirrored measures 1 to 15 in measures 30 to 45. All
went well until layout time (Note value layout). When the train went away,
I was left with all but the mirrored measures looking good. The mirrored
measures were crunched down to the size of a default, no note measure.
Please tell me what I'm missing here or is mirroring designed to be only
for vertical measures (many staves). Thanks.
-Rob Burns
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 12:14:39 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 12:15:10 -0600 (CST)
From: "E. Van Houzen" <evanhouz@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
CC: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Layout of Mirrored measures
Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.91.950123121148.23819B-100000@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Rob,
I would use the mass mover tool and select measures one through fifteen
and copy then select measures 15 through 30 and replace measures. This
method has always worked well for me.
Erin Van Houzen

On Mon, 23 Jan 1995, Rob Burns wrote:

> The other day I was trying out mirroring as a way to save time when
> a piece with repeated sections. It was a guitar arrangement of a popular
> tune on 1 stave. I mirrored measures 1 to 15 in measures 30 to 45.> went well until layout time (e value layout). When the train went
away,
> I was left with all but the mirrored measures looking good. The mirrored
> measures were crunched down to the size of a default, no note measure.
> Please tell me what I'm missing here or is mirroring designed to be only
> for vertical measures (many staves). Thanks.
> -Rob Burns
>
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 12:14:44 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 12:15:10 -0600 (CST)
From: "E. Van Houzen" <evanhouz@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
CC: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Layout of Mirrored measures
Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.91.950123121148.23819B-100000@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Rob,
I would use the mass mover tool and select measures one through fifteen
and copy then select measures 15 through 30 and replace measures. This
method has always worked well for me.
Erin Van Houzen

On Mon, 23 Jan 1995, Rob Burns wrote:

> The other day I was trying out mirroring as a way to save time when
> a piece with repeated sections. It was a guitar arrangement of a popular
> tune on 1 stave. I mirrored measures 1 to 15 in measures 30 to 45.> went well until layout time (e value layout). When the train went
away,
> I was left with all but the mirrored measures looking good. The mirrored
> measures were crunched down to the size of a default, no note measure.
> Please tell me what I'm missing here or is mirroring designed to be only
> for vertical measures (many staves). Thanks.
> -Rob Burns
>
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 15:26:36 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 95 15:09:31 CST
From: Becca Remley <RDREMLEY%[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], RDREMLEY%[email protected]
Subject: Faculty Vacancy
To: Finale List <[email protected]>, Music Performance and Pedagogy List <musprf-l%[email protected]>, ATMI <[email protected]>

As a member of this group, I hope you don't mind my posting this oIf you.
have any questions feel free to ask me through e-mail.

Rebecca Remley ([email protected])
Assistant Professor
School of Music
Samford University
Birmingham, AL 35229

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Position: Assistant Director of Bands and Teacher of Percussion or
Low Brass

Responsibilities: Assist with Marching Band; direct Jazz Ensemble; teach
percussion or low brass; supplementary teaching responsibilities
in music theory, music appreciation or music education.

Qualifications: Completed doctorate or ABD, with emphasis in either music
education, percussion, or low brass; experience with marching
bands and jazz ensembles; performance skills and teaching
experience with percussion or low brass.

Rank: Assistant Professor or Instructor (if ABD)

Starting Date: August 1995

Application: Send letter of application, curriculum vitae, graduate
transcripts, and three letters of recommendation to:
Mr. Jon Remley, Chair
Instrumental Search Committee
School of Music
Samford University
Birmingham, AL 35229

APPLICATION DEADLINE IS FEBRUARY 15, 1995

General: Samford University is the largest privately supported, fully
accredited institution for higher learning in Alabama, with
an enrollment of over 4,500. The School of Music, one of eight
schools comprising the University, has 17 fullgophertime faculty
members and an enrollment of 126 music majors.
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 16:59:46 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
X-MX-Warning: Warning -- Invalid "From" header.
From: Eric A. Slutz <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: winfin update from 3.0
To: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 95 14:59:46 PST
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Message/rfc822

Has the update from Windows Finale 3.0 appeared on the internet yet?
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 20:05:41 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 18:06:18 -0800 (PST)
From: LAMONT DOWNS <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: RE: Re:stuff to customize
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


On Sun, 22 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:
>
> demographic. I am sure you are also aware of the proliferation of poorly
> engraved publications of which there are also many. The standards for music
> publication has been brought to its knees by the availability of notation
> software and the eagerness of the fledgling amateur to do the grunt work.

Without getting involved in the other issues in this post, I would have to
question the "proliferation of poorly engraved publications." I catalog
scores for a university library and see examples covering a very wide
time period. After using Finale for several years I've become a bit
'sensitized' to engraving quality, and was rather surprised to discover
that even a 'fledgling amateur' on Finale could probably produce better
copy than 90% of the scores I see. Even Schirmer, with it's much-
admired (by some) standards, has put out an awful lot of stuff repro-
duced directly from a copyist's manuscript. There really seem to be very
few publishing houses that have consistently put out decent engraving
over any period of time. Has anyone _really_ been affected by that
circumstance? I'm sure most performers would much prefer mediocre
Finale output to the reproductions of what appear to be pencil scores
that a certain Eastern house uses for its brass chamber catalog.

Also, from the composer's viewpoint, if being able to create original copy
for a publication a bit more cheaply means a publisher can take a few more
chances on works which may not make much money, then I'm all in favor of
'lower standards.' My one experience with a major publisher involved a
delay between signing the contract and actually seeing the finished
product of over 6 years, which at least partly involved having the copy
engraved in (!)Japan(!). I wonder if getting the note spacing alotments
just so was really worth that...

Lamont Downs
[email protected]
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 20:22:44 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Harp pedals

Hello all. Are there any WinFin 3.x.x users out there that create harp
pedal diagrams as described in the documentation. I've found that they do
*not* work as described in the manual (which should be the the same as in
version 2.x, which worked beautifully). Has anyone run across this problem?

I've called it to the attention of Coda, but I have yet to hear even a
confirmation of the problem. I would think that this is a major quirk in
the new version.

Dan

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>>
Dan Galbraith <> [email protected] <> (913) 599-5456 <> Overland Park, KS <>
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
"Through the modem, off the gateway, around the router.... nothing but net!"

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 22:47:39 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 22:43:59 -0600 (CST)
From: Brian J Campbell <brianjc@jove.acs.unt.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale Mail-list <[email protected]>
Subject: That 3.2.1 updater again,
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950123224240.27946B-100000@jove.acs.unt.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Ok, since my school seems to be a little slow on the FTP site, I put
another copy of the Mac updater in, of all places, FTP.SHSU.EDU. At the
moment, it is in the incoming directory, and I don't know if you can
access it from there. Hopefully, when it is moved the operator will be
nice enough to inform me as to where he has placed it. GOOD LUCK!

Brian Campbell
/----------------\
|-----------------------------------|----------------------------------------|
|STUCK at UNT Department of Music |INTERNET: brianjc@jove.acs.unt.edu |
|in lovely Denton, Texas, USA |Snail:526 Alegre Vista;Denton, TX 76205 |
|Jazz/Arranging/Comp/Saxophone/Winds|Voice: (817) 382-7131 |
|-----------(It's not a town, just an Incredible Simulation)-----------------|
\__________________________________________________________________/

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 23:23:47 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 00:21:11 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: RE: Re:stuff to customize

Larry Worster writes:

>>...I share your concern but are the major players in music
publication really buying the work of rank amateurs with little experience
and no concept of punctuation, John?<<

Larry- Thank you for your philosophical slant on this issue. It is nice to
think that maybe some tradition is upheld in the current scheme of things.

As for your question about the "major players" accepting low-level engraving
work, the answer, thankfully, is no they are not. But, keeping things in
perspective, there is a proliferation of new music publishers on the block.
They aren't major players but they ARE contenders for their share of the pie.
They have a few good titles and a few well-known and respected writers, and
poof, they're music publishers. I attended the Midwest Band and Orchestra
Clinic held here (annually) in Chicago last month. Many publishers booths
were decked out to display their old and new pieces. There were major and
minor players and some little league companies, too. I could not believe the
range of engraving qualities - 1st class work down to
"Finale-default-setting" crap - and everything in between.

This is the reason that I contend:
>>I am sure you are also aware of the proliferation of poorly engraved
publications of which there are also many. The standards for music
publication has been brought to its knees by the availability of notation
software and the eagerness of the fledgling amateur to do the grunt work.<<

There is good news and bad news in all of this, however. Obviously, the good
news is if there are more players, there will be more opportunity for us. The
bad news is, can we possibly compete if the accepted engraving standards are
reduced to the lowest common denominator? Of course the wages paid for such
work would also be commensurate.

All we can hope for is that the quality and integrity of our work will speak
for itself and that our clients will continue to appreciate our efforts and
our high(er) standards.

John Blane
Blane Music Preparation
Chicago, IL 60607
(312) 455-1100
(312) 455-1162 Fax
[email protected]
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 07:51:45 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 06:52:23 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale group <[email protected]>
Subject: Engraving standards
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

John
Thanks for the well-thought-out answer. It is important to view
each subject free of the self-interest that often colors our opinions. I
hope we are both right in our belief that quality and an artistic approach
to the process of engraving will be rewarded. I certainly agree with the
members of our group who point out that the standards of the previous
generations were not that great from the hand-copied, published works of
the xerox generation of publishers way back to the sloppily engraved
works of lesser known composers (read, women) of the nineteenth and early
twentieth centuries many of whose works I have copied for re-publication.
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 08:26:13 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 14:20:03 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alvaro Torrente <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
CC: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Layout of Mirrored measures
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.91.950124140200.981A-100000@puce.csi.cam.ac.uk>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Mon, 23 Jan 1995, Rob Burns wrote:

> The other day I was trying out mirroring as a way to save time when
> a piece with repeated sections. It was a guitar arrangement of a popular
> tune on 1 stave. I mirrored measures 1 to 15 in measures 30 to 45. All
> went well until layout time (Note value layout). When the train went away,
> I was left with all but the mirrored measures looking good. The mirrored
> measures were crunched dofault, no note measure.
> Please tell me what I'm missing here or is mirroring designed to be only
> for vertical measures (many staves). Thanks.
> -Rob Burns

Rob,

I have not used mirrors for a long time (when I was working with Fin/Mac
2.6.3) so perhaps my experience is not very up to date. I do not have
Finale here so I cannot check with the latest version.

Mirror Tool only copies Entry Items (notes, lyrics, articulations etc.).
If you want Measure Items to be also copied you have to do the process in
to steps:

1.- Make the mirror copy as you did the first time. You will get all the
entries in the new place.
2.- Select Copy and Replace in the Mass Mover Menu and select Measure
Items. In the dialogue box you can set the items you want to copy
(measure widths, positioning, smart shapes etc.)
3.- Copy again the source measures in the destination place.

After this you will have destination measures looking as the source ones.
Note that mirroring only refers to entries, so if you make changes in
the source measures you will have to do steps 2 and 3 again.

My experience with Mirror Tool in Fin 2.6.3 was a bit frustrating. I used
it intensively in a large orchestral score and I always found the same
problem. When entries where added in the source measure, the destination
measure become a sort of chaos. I would like to know if anyone had the
same experience and if the problem still exists in Fin 3.2.

Alvaro Torrente Tl: (0223) 324533
St Catharine's College Fax: (0223) 338340
Cambridge CB2 1RL E-Mail: [email protected]
UNITED KINGDOM

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 08:47:01 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Robert Patterson <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale News Group <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: Harp pedals
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 95 08:48:00 CST
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Your best bet for harp pedal charts is to use the Crescendo font, which I
have for the mac, but I would be surprised if there isn't a Windows version.
Cassady & Greene was the publisher when I bought it, but that may have
changed.

Robert
----------
From: owner-finale
To: finale
Subject: Harp pedals
Date: Monday, January 23, 1995 8:45PM

Hello all. Are there any WinFin 3.x.x users out there that create harp
pedal diagrams as described in the documentation. I've found that they do
*not* work as described in the manual (which should be the the same as in
version 2.x, which worked beautifully). Has anyone run across this problem?

I've called it to the attention of Coda, but I have yet to hear even a
confirmation of the problem. I would think that this is a major quirk in
the new version.

Dan

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>>
Dan Galbraith <> [email protected] <> (913) 599-5456 <> Overland Park, KS <>
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
"Through the modem, off the gateway, around the router.... nothing but
net!"

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 10:24:15 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 95 11:24:00 EST
From: [email protected] (Rich Rinehart)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: RE: Re:stuff to customize

>On Sun, 22 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:
>>
>> demographic. I am sure you are also aware of the proliferation of poorly
>> engraved publications of which there are also many. The standards for music
>> publication has been brought to its knees by the availability of notation
>> software and the eagerness of the fledgling amateur to do the grunt work.
>
Lamont Downs writes:
>Without getting involved in the other issues in this post, I would have to
>question the "proliferation of poorly engraved publications." I catalog
>scores for a university library and see examples covering a very wide
>time period. After using Finale for several years I've become a bit
>'sensitized' to engraving quality, and was rather surprised to discover
>that even a 'fledgling amateur' on Finale could probably produce better
>copy than 90% of the scores I see. Even Schirmer, with it's much-
>admired (by some) standards, has put out an awful lot of stuff repro-
>duced directly from a copyist's manuscript. There really seem to be very
>few publishing houses that have consistently put out decent engraving
>over any period of time. Has anyone _really_ been affected by that
>circumstance? I'm sure most performers would much prefer mediocre
>Finale output to the reproductions of what appear to be pencil scores
>that a certain Eastern house uses for its brass chamber catalog.

At the Cleveland Chamber Symphony concert last night, I was amazed at the
questionable presentation quality of some of the world premiere scores that
were performed (the *music* was wonderful). The conductor, Ed London, even
joked that one score was faxed in as it was taped together on *very* thin
paper. I noticed a real rats nests on players stand with other works. And
this is a professional group here performing works from professional musical
types (like found on this mailing list, my amateur self not included and no
offense intended:-)).

I guess my point here is that when there is a will, there is a "play". (An-
other point would be that folks should worry not only with the contents but
with the physical delivery).
2 cents-
-rich

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rich Rinehart | phone: 216-433-5211
NASA Lewis Research Center | email: [email protected]
Cleveland, OH | http://warhol.lerc.nasa.gov/rich.html
"Best damn mail handler I every had"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 10:44:09 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 10:44:43 -0600
Message-ID: <ab4a89b6000210048ee7@[131.151.27.58]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (douglas stotter)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: RE: Harp pedals

At 2:47 PM 1/24/95, Robert Patterson wrote:
>Your best bet for harp pedal charts is to use the Crescendo font, which I
>have for the mac, but I would be surprised if there isn't a Windows version.
>Cassady & Greene was the publisher when I bought it, but that may have
>changed.
>
Also the GoldenAge font distributed by:
EVS
1-800-650-2427
GoldenAge is four font sets: Music, Text, Titles, and Extras all with a
"manuscript" look. For harp pedaling, there are four characters that, when
used in combination, can make any harp diagram. There are also characters
for sustain pedaling and other indications that Petrucci does not have.



////////////////////////////////////////////
// //
// Douglas Stotter //
// Director of Bands //
// 132 Castleman Hall //
// University of Missouri-Rolla //
// Rolla, MO 65401 //
// (314) 341-4698 //
// [email protected] //
// //
////////////////////////////////////////////

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 11:49:19 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: "Louis Pape" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 11:49:29 CST
Subject: I was bumped off
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

subscribe [email protected]
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 11:56:18 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 13:24:35 +0100
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Paul Paterson)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Formatting multi-mvt. pts.

In working with multi-movement works, e.g. suites, I have been treating
each mvt. as a separate document. This has obvious advantages when working
with the score but it results in the parts for each mvt. being produced as
separate documents. In some instances it be would preferable to print a
mvt. partway down a page after the conclusion of the previous one. Is
there a method for doing this other than resorting to the creative use of
paper cutter, whiteout and photocopier?

Paul Paterson

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 12:42:30 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab4af88302021004da85@[158.135.73.248]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 12:43:12 -0600
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Henry Howey)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Formatting multi-mvt. pts.

>In working with multi-movement works, e.g. suites, I have been treating
>each mvt. as a separate document. This has obvious advantages when working
>with the score but it results in the parts for each mvt. being produced as
>separate documents. In some instances it be would preferable to print a
>mvt. partway down a page after the conclusion of the previous one. Is
>there a method for doing this other than resorting to the creative use of
>paper cutter, whiteout and photocopier?

I have enough space to eventually create scores (and parts) with several
movements. The titles become score expressions and look very nice. There
is some tweaking, but I like the final result.



Henry Howey
Professor
Department of Music
Sam Houston State University
Huntsville, TX 77341
[email protected]
FAX (409) 294-3765
W (409) 294-1364
H (409) 291-0626
Owner of FINALE Discussion List





================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 13:27:35 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab4afb3f060210047f02@[158.135.73.248]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 13:26:02 -0600
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Henry Howey)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Layout of Mirrored measures

I believe that an early consensus was that the Mirror tool was fraught with
problems. Even to use it to create TUTTI passages may cause frustration
and lost time. As yet, no one has experimented with it enough to devise a
protocol for its safe use.



Henry Howey
Professor
Department of Music
Sam Houston State University
Huntsville, TX 77341
[email protected]
FAX (409) 294-3765
W (409) 294-1364
H (409) 291-0626
Owner of FINALE Discussion List





================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 18:04:45 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 15:46:37 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Formatting multi-mvt. pts.

>>In working with multi-movement works, e.g. suites, I have been treating
each mvt. as a separate document. This has obvious advantages when working
with the score but it results in the parts for each mvt. being produced as
separate documents. In some instances it be would preferable to print a
mvt. partway down a page after the conclusion of the previous one. Is
there a method for doing this other than resorting to the creative use of
paper cutter, whiteout and photocopier?

Paul Paterson<<

EPS files - Illustrator and Pagemaker are the tools I use for putting
together multi-movement works. This allows the most flexibility for page
layout without the side-effects.

Tom Ginsberg-Copyist
U.S . Marine Band
Wash, DC
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 18:09:56 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab4b3d050002100478ca@[198.59.4.202]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 16:43:45 -0700
To: <[email protected]>, <[email protected]>
From: [email protected] (Ofer Ben-Amots)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Layout of Mirrored measures

In my experience, the MIRROR TOOL is absolutly redundant. I have used
Finale since v. 1.2 and never found any use for it. I can do all the
copying I need with the MASS MOVER TOOL and would not regret if the MIRROR
TOOL be eliminated alltogether.

On the other hand one of the nicest features of Finale has been eliminated
(since v3.0) for no apparent reason: In the past I was able to move
excessive notes (*THERE ARE TOO MANY NOTES IN THE MEASURE... dialog box) to
the next measure without deleting the next measure's entries. The notes
would simply be added before letting me decide about my next step. In the
current version if you move extra notes to the next measure the old entries
are being deleted and replaced with those extra notes. I wish CODA would
let me decide if I want those entries deleted or not.

I wonder what other composers on this list think about this two points.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
| Ofer Ben-Amots |
| The Colorado College |
| Music Department |
| Tel: 719-389-6555 |
| Fax: 719-389-6862 |
| [email protected] |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 18:57:35 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab4b51ef00021004c71c@[198.59.4.202]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 18:02:53 -0700
To: <[email protected]>, <[email protected]>
From: [email protected] (Ofer Ben-Amots)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: That 3.2.1 updater again,

Dear Brian,

Thank you for your messages. I finally found the files. Unfortunately, I
was not able to convert the text files with either binhex4.bin or stuffIt
Expander. I tried using Fetch 2.1.2, Mosaic, NCSA FTP session, etc. I do
get the file every time but only as a text file.

Am I missing something again?

I am sorry to bother you with my little downloading problem but I thought
you might help me. Thanx a million.

-- Ofer

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 19:41:54 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab4b5da30002100486d4@[198.59.4.202]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 18:47:05 -0700
To: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected] (Ofer Ben-Amots)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: That 3.2.1 updater again,

Oops..., I goofed. My last message has been sent *mistakenly* to the entire
list.

-- Ofer

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
| Ofer Ben-Amots |
| The Colorado College |
| Music Department |
| Tel: 719-389-6555 |
| Fax: 719-389-6862 |
| [email protected] |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 21:23:49 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 22:16:44 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Layout of Mirrored measures

While we're at it, has CODA dealt with the bizarre problem where pickup
measures become unintended mirrors??
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 22:26:18 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 20:28:34 -0800
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Kevin Moore)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Finale problem w/ PB 520

My friend's PB 520 sometimes enters chords when it should be entering
single notes. It seems to remember any extraneous MIDI notes played while
not in Speedy Note and add them to the next legitimate entry.

This doesn't happen with Vision & other MIDI apps.

He's using a standard apple interface and a Yamaha SY-55 keyboard.

I tried it with my Studio 4 interface and Kawai K-1 keyboard and couldn't
reproduce the problem. Weird.

Any ideas???

Thanks in advance.

Kevin Moore
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 00:11:22 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Boudewijn)
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Who owns data file?/Ties
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 95 20:51:06 CET
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]

In article <[email protected]> ([email protected])
wrote on Re: Who owns data file?/Ties

> As for the ties issue, they are thoroughly and completely inadequate.
No
> changing of the settings improves them. In fact, I would argue that any
> change from the default makes them worse, because the Postscript Settings
> for ties (the only ones that matter, btw, if you use postscript) don't do
> what they are supposed to do--or at least what the manual implies that they
> do. The tie feature of Finale is BROKE BROKE BROKE, and we can only hope
> that someday they fix it.
>
> Robert

But then, having tried almost every Windows program under the sun, I
have never met one with a usable tie function. Even worse; I have never
met a program that could do even a fraction of what I wanted to do.

--
Boudewijn Rempt
A.C. Krusemanstraat 57
2032 HE Haarlem
+31-23-354918
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 00:48:47 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Layout of Mirrored measures

>While we're at it, has CODA dealt with the bizarre problem where pickup
>measures become unintended mirrors??
>

Hear, hear! I have completely given up on pickup measures, because they
kept corrupting my files with these "phantom" mirrors! I simply use a full
measure and then hide the first few beats.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>>
Dan Galbraith <> [email protected] <> (913) 599-5456 <> Overland Park, KS <>
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
"Through the modem, off the gateway, around the router.... nothing but net!"

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 07:53:06 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 06:53:42 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Formatting multi-mvt. pts.
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Tue, 24 Jan 1995, Paul Paterson wrote:

> In working with multi-movement works, e.g. suites, I have been treating
> each mvt. as a separate document. This has obvious advantages when working
> with the score but it results in the parts for each mvt. being produced as
> separate documents. In some instances it be would preferable to print a
> mvt. partway down a page after the conclusion of the previous one. Is
> there a method for doing this other than resorting to the creative use of
> paper cutter, whiteout and photocopier?

Tom Ginsberg's idea of using eps files works if you own Freehand or
Illustrator. I have often pasted the first few measures of a movement
onto the tail of the previous movement. I then create the proper space at
the end of the movement by adding space to the last system of the first
movement in the page layout window. Of course you have to adjust the
indent of the first system of the next movement and adjust the layout
again. Then in the next movement force all the systems not appearing at
the end of the previous movment onto a separate page by adding a large
amount to the space under the last system included in the previous
movment.

As I wrote this I realized that the explanation is really more complex
than the procedure. If you still have questions I'll explain more fully.
The final wrinkle is that to create parts, I often paste all of the
movements together into a giant document (too large to work with
practically speaking) for part extraction. I throw this document away
after extracting the parts.
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 08:23:48 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 09:25:09 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu (John C. Werner)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Layout of Mirrored measures

>>While we're at it, has CODA dealt with the bizarre problem where pickup
>>measures become unintended mirrors??
>>
>
>Hear, hear! I have completely given up on pickup measures, because they
>kept corrupting my files with these "phantom" mirrors! I simply use a full
>measure and then hide the first few beats.
>
>
I, too have given up on the "pickup" measure. Sometimes I have difficulty
with spacing of the measure when I hide the first beats, so I make a
measure of 1/4 time (or whatever is appropriate to the number of pickup
notes) and hide the time signature for that measure and for the measure
that follows since the change in time signature will result in an automatic
display. This results in more satisfying spacing using the usual methods.
When pickup beats occur in the middle of a document, a similar technique
seems to work for the 3 measure (before, of, and after the pickup)
surrounding the measure. It also sounds OK on playback, which is important
to me since I do most of my proofreading on playback.

Chris Werner, pediatric cardiologist, music lover, Brown University
father, clarinetist, singer, accompanist, non-sailor. Medical School
Providence, RI
John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu (401)444-5984

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 09:10:58 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 95 07:08:36 pst
From: "Blake Hodgetts" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re[2]: Who owns data file?/Ties

In article <[email protected]> ([email protected])
wrote on Re: Who owns data file?/Ties

> As for the ties issue, they are thoroughly and completely inadequate.
No
> changing of the settings improves them. In fact, I would argue that any
> change from the default makes them worse, because the Postscript Settings
> for t
ies (the only ones that matter, btw, if you use postscript) don't do
> what they are supposed to do--or at least what the manual implies that they
> do. The tie feature of Finale is BROKE BROKE BROKE, and we can only hope
> that someday they fix it.
>
> Robert

Well, that is going a bit far. I don't know which platform you are using, but on
the Mac I have devised ties settings that work quite well for most musical
situations. I would never call them "thoroughly and completely inadequate".
There is one point, however, that I wish Coda could do something about (Eric?
Tech Support? Development, are you listening?): the tie settings I use cause the
ties to collide with the dot on dotted notes when those notes fall on a line
(rather than on a space). They look perfect otherwise, but I have to manually
adjust ties that follow dotted line-notes, a great pain in the rear (especially
in compound meters!). It would be nice if there were a configurable option for
"ties after dots" which took into account whether the notes are on lines or on
spaces. I have also noticed that ties on whole notes are placed too close to the
notehead; Finale needs to be aware of the different sizes of noteheads (this
should be configurable as well). Basically, there should be a whole dialog box's
worth of settings for Ties, not just a couple of fields.

If anyone has a further interest in this, I will share with him/her my tie
settings, arrived at after considerable experimentation and the printing of
dozens of examples.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Blake Hodgetts / "Life is the only *
Musician / thing we have * [email protected]
Eugene, Oregon / worth living" *
Opinions represented above are mine, not my employer's
-----------------------------------------------------------

The following is an attached File item from cc:Mail. It contains
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================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 09:39:47 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 08:40:28 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale group <[email protected]>
Subject: Pickup measures
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Just a note of clarification. This pickup measure discussion must only
apply to WinFinale as I have never had any problems with pickup measures
in FinMac. For pickup measures in the middle of the piece I use the
mirror tool to insert invisible rests. I usually have to manually adjust
the spacing and widths of these measures but what's new about that.
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 09:56:05 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 95 07:54:23 pst
From: "Blake Hodgetts" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Who owns files/Ties


In article <[email protected]> ([email protected])
wrote on Re: Who owns data file?/Ties

> As for the ties issue, they are thoroughly and completely inadequate.
No
> changing of the settings improves them. In fact, I would argue that any
> change from the default makes them worse, because the Postscript Settings
> for t
ies (the only ones that matter, btw, if you use postscript) don't do
> what they are supposed to do--or at least what the manual implies that they
> do. The tie feature of Finale is BROKE BROKE BROKE, and we can only hope
> that someday they fix it.
>
> Robert

Well, that is going a bit far. I don't know which platform you are using, but on

the Mac I have devised ties settings that work quite well for most musical
situations. I would never call them "thoroughly and completely inadequate".
There is one point, however, that I wish Coda could do something about (Eric?
Tech Support? Development, are you listening?): the tie settings I use cause the

ties to collide with the dot on dotted notes when those notes fall on a line
(rather than on a space). They look perfect otherwise, but I have to manually
adjust ties that follow dotted line-notes, a great pain in the rear (especially
in compound meters!). It would be nice if there were a configurable option for
"ties after dots" which took into account whether the notes are on lines or on
spaces. I have also noticed that ties on whole notes are placed too close to the

notehead; Finale needs to be aware of the different sizes of noteheads (this
should be configurable as well). Basically, there should be a whole dialog box's

worth of settings for Ties, not just a couple of fields.

If anyone has a further interest in this, I will share with him/her my tie
settings, arrived at after considerable experimentation and the printing of
dozens of examples.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Blake Hodgetts / "Life is the only *
Musician / thing we have * [email protected]
Eugene, Oregon / worth living" *
Opinions represented above are mine, not my employer's
-----------------------------------------------------------

The following is an attached File item from cc:Mail. It contains
information that had to be encoded to ensure successful transmission
through various mail systems. To decode the file use the UUDECODE
program.
--------------------------------- Cut Here ---------------------------------
begin 644 rfc822.txt
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end

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end

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 10:08:08 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Return-Path: <yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il>
From: yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il (Yuval Shay-El)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <9501251807.ZM18907@cyclone.tau.ac.il>
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 18:07:37 +0000
To: [email protected]
Subject: Upgrade to WinFin 3.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
MIME-Version: 1.0

I just received my Finale for Windows 3.0 upgrade. However I noticed that
people here are speaking about 3.0.1 or even 3.0.2 maintenance upgrades. Any
information about these upgrades? Should I bug Coda about it? (They are not
going to like to send it free to me, since mailing abroad is pretty expensive).

Thanks,
Yuval

--
Yuval Shay-El
Department of Geophysics | Home address:
and Planetary Sciences | 19 Granados
Tel-Aviv University | Ramat Gan, 52326
Tel-Aviv 69978 | Israel
Israel |
Fax: 972-3-6409282 | Tel: 972-3-5741634
Tel: 972-3-6409120 |
e-mail: yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 10:09:27 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 10:39:47 -0500
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (David Froom)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: That 3.2.1 updater again,

>Oops..., I goofed. My last message has been sent *mistakenly* to the entire
>list.
>
>-- Ofer
>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>| Ofer Ben-Amots |
>| The Colorado College |
>| Music Department |
>| Tel: 719-389-6555 |
>| Fax: 719-389-6862 |
>| [email protected] |
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Ofer,

Someone was kind enough to email 3.2.1 to me. I've got it here on my
computer and would be glad to email it to you. Just let me know via return
mail, and it will be on its way.

David Froom - [email protected]
Music Department
St. Mary's College of Maryland
St. Mary's City, Maryland

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 11:15:22 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab4c376501021004323e@[158.135.73.248]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 11:16:06 -0600
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Henry Howey)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: That 3.2.1 updater again,

It is now at SUMEX and UMICH. I cannot say how they will organize it, but
it will be in the recent arrivals for a few days.



Henry Howey
Professor
Department of Music
Sam Houston State University
Huntsville, TX 77341
[email protected]
FAX (409) 294-3765
W (409) 294-1364
H (409) 291-0626
Owner of FINALE Discussion List





================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 11:44:12 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab4c3e4005021004ce96@[158.135.73.248]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 11:44:57 -0600
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Henry Howey)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Pickup measures

Larry Worster writes:

>Just a note of clarification. This pickup measure discussion must only
>apply to WinFinale as I have never had any problems with pickup measures
>in FinMac.

I think that pickups with tuplets are a real problem which require much
tweaking.



Henry Howey
Professor
Department of Music
Sam Houston State University
Huntsville, TX 77341
[email protected]
FAX (409) 294-3765
W (409) 294-1364
H (409) 291-0626
Owner of FINALE Discussion List





================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 11:59:02 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Layout of Mirrored measures

>I, too have given up on the "pickup" measure. Sometimes I have difficulty
>with spacing of the measure when I hide the first beats, so I make a
>measure of 1/4 time (or whatever is appropriate to the number of pickup
>notes) and hide the time signature for that measure and for the measure
>that follows since the change in time signature will result in an automatic
>display. This results in more satisfying spacing using the usual methods.
>When pickup beats occur in the middle of a document, a similar technique
>seems to work for the 3 measure (before, of, and after the pickup)
>surrounding the measure. It also sounds OK on playback, which is important
>to me since I do most of my proofreading on playback.

I find that it's a simple procedure to adjust the first (pickup) measure
manually, using the lower handle provided by the barline tool - you can even
adjust "sub-beats" by double-clicking in between beats in the top of the
editing window. This *might* even prove to be a better choice than using
time signatures, although I haven't tried it your way.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>>
Dan Galbraith <> [email protected] <> (913) 599-5456 <> Overland Park, KS <>
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
"Through the modem, off the gateway, around the router.... nothing but net!"

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 12:02:19 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 95 11:37 CST
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Thomas Schaller)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Layout of Mirrored measures

>I, too have given up on the "pickup" measure. Sometimes I have difficulty
>with spacing of the measure when I hide the first beats, so I make a
>measure of 1/4 time (or whatever is appropriate to the number of pickup
>notes) and hide the time signature for that measure and for the measure
>that follows since the change in time signature will result in an automatic
>display. This results in more satisfying spacing using the usual methods.

The only problem you will have with that is the lack of display of the time
signature in the beginning of a piece. So if you guys really don't want to
use the Pickup box in the Format (Music Options=Finale 3.x) menu - which
works much better than any of this scary Mirror stuff - I would suggest you
create a measure at the beginning of a piece that bears the time signature
you need for the whole piece. After this measure create your "pickup
measure', like 1/4. Then change the appearance of the first measure: No
barline, width:0. For the second and third measure: hide time signatures.

>><<>><<>><<>><<
Thomas Schaller
(312) 922-3616
Chicago, IL 60605
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 12:10:51 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 12:11:09 -0600 (CST)
From: michael eckert <meckert@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale <[email protected]>
Subject: Distance between staves
Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.91.950125115838.81760A-100000@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I am using FInale 3.2 Mac (waiting for the "fix" from Coda since I have
no idea how to access ftp or whatever) and have some questions in
connection with a current project involving several Renaissance choral
works (SATB or SATBarB, no accomp.)

1. Since the "Respace" command for staves only works in Scroll View,
hence affects all staves, how can one change (uniformly) the distance
between the staves of the voice parts within a staff group on a
page-by-page basis? I ended up having to use one document for pp. 1-2
with one setting, and a copy for pp. 3-4 with another setting.

2. Is there a way to copy music (e.g., a couple of pages) from one
document into another? I don't have PageMaker or any other similar software.

3. A suggestion: could we all write to the Coda Technical Development
folks and ask them to PLEEZE make it possible to fine-tune whether bar
lines run between staves or not? The most egregious problem with Finale
is that one cannot create a final barline that connects all staves if one
chooses to break barlines between staves elsewhere in the document.
(Also, a Long note woule be a nice character to have, i.e., a square
double-whole note with a stem on it.)

4. Has anyone tried the "tricks" for getting high-resolution printing on
a StyleWriter (making the music 5 times larger and then selecting 20% in
Print Preferences)? I couldn't get this to work with a piece where the
basic size was set at 76%, either by simply multiplying that percentage
by 5 or by the method using the page dimensions.

Any advice on these topics will be warmly appreciated. I am using a IIsi,
by the way, which is, as Luigi Dallapiccola once said about the
composition "profession," "the school of patience."

Michael Eckert
Assoc. Professor
School of Music
The University of Iowa
Iowa City IA 52242-1795


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 14:33:33 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 14:55:38 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Pickup measures

Right...this is a WinFin quirkolette. The whole mirror thing seems to create
more problems than it solves, at least for me. I haven't run into anything
that COPY and/or TRANSPOSE wouldn't handle.
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 14:35:15 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 14:57:34 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Upgrade to WinFin 3.0

I think it has been placed at at least one FTP site, perhaps FTP.SHSU.EDU.
Please check past posts on this topic.
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 14:44:00 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 09:44:37 +1300
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Alternatives to Petrucci?

I have been off the list for a month so ignore this if it has been aired
recently.
Can anyone recommend alternative fonts to Petrucci. Something that looks
different and can be slotted into an existing file without too much
tweaking. I know GoldenAge is an option.

It has just occurred to me how to (easily) get midi active trills and other
decorative events in Finale. (something that is simple to do in Overture)
Enter your trill (live or whatever) on one layer. Hide it. Enter the full
value note with its trill symbol on another layer and give that note a midi
note on value of zero. Trouble will occur if you use allotments to space
the bar but otherwise all sorts of midi activity could go on 'behind' the
written notes.

[email protected]
School of Music
Victoria University of Wellington
P O Box 600, Wellington,
New Zealand,
Telephone (04) 471 5369
Fax (04) 495 5157

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 15:20:50 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 16:22:47 -0500 (EST)
From: "Meredith M. Williams" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Finale for Windows 3.0.1 updater
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

I downloaded the Windows 3.0.1 updater from AOL and posted it to
alt.binaries.sounds.utilities. It's over 1.2Mb uuencoded so I won't send it
to the list. I'll try uploading it to a ftp site if someone would suggest
a good one.

Meredith
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 15:50:02 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a good copyist
From: [email protected] (Ana Kellia Ramares)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 95 12:16:48 PST

>
>

David,

Where the heck do you think that I am questioning the integrity of music
copyists or suggesting that they not be paid?

There is a difference to me between a tool and a work of art. When I want
a score copied, I am interested in a legible and musically accurate
score. But I am no more looking to buy an artist's engraving, than I am
looking for an illuminated manuscript when I seek out a word processing
professional.

Yes it would have been nice if CODA had abided by the engraving standards
in its defaults. It would have been even nicer if it had been easier to
use so that composers who don't want to become engravers can simply
print out legible accurate music.

Its a matter of economy and functionality, not of anyone's integrity.
Sure, it's nice to drink from crystal goblets, but sometimes plastic mugs
do the job quite well.

Kellia
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 18:12:31 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 16:13:05 -0800
Message-ID: <v02110103ab4af609ff7a@[204.29.16.93]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (dwight thomas)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Harp pedals

Another good choice for harp pedal marks is Don Rice's Golden Age Music font, which handles the pedasimilarly to Crescendo; in fact he credits them for the idea. Don Rice is a frequent contributor otis listserv, and the addresses for obtaining his fonts have appeared here several times.

>Hello all. Are there any WinFin 3.x.x users out there that create harp
>pedal diagrams as described in the documentation. I've found that they do
>*not* work as described in the manual (which should be the the same as in
>version 2.x, which worked beautifully). Has anyone run across this problem?
>
>I've called it to the attention of Coda, but I have yet to hear even a
>confirmation of the problem. I would think that this is a major quirk in
>the new version.
>


\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/

Dwight Thomas - Omaha Symphony
e mail address - [email protected]

/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 18:50:09 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 17:50:50 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Distance between staves
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Wed, 25 Jan 1995, michael eckert wrote:

> 1. Since the "Respace" command for staves only works in Scroll View,
> hence affects all staves, how can one change (uniformly) the distance
> between the staves of the voice parts within a staff group on a
> page-by-page basis? I ended up having to use one document for pp. 1-2
> with one setting, and a copy for pp. 3-4 with another setting.

There are two ways to do this both of which involve optimization.
Optimization does two things besides getting rid of unwanted staves. (If
you are having staves dissappear which you want do the optimization in
the page layout window by checking the box and following the instructions
in the following dialogue boxes.) Optimization freezes the appearance
(and spacing) of the staves on the page while providing positioning
handles for fine tuning the position. So for your problem. Adjust the
spacing in scroll view for page one and two. Go to page view (or better
yet have the two views in two windows) and optimize the staves on those
pages. Go back to the scroll view window and adjust the spacing for pages
3-4. Go to the page layout window and optimize the staves for those
pages. (This is also handy for having brackets appear differently in
different areas of the document. Optimization freezes the brackets in
page view.) You may decide to tweak the system layout in page view now
using the Staff Attributes Tool.

> 2. Is there a way to copy music (e.g., a couple of pages) from one
> document into another? I don't have PageMaker or any other similar software.

Sure. Select, copy, move to the second document, select a measure, and
choose insert music. It's not fast but it is effective. Be aware that all
staff or score expressions within the copied music will be pasted into
the staff expressions window. This is often better accomplished by
pasting before entering the expression unless this doesn't bother you.

>
> 3. A suggestion: could we all write to the Coda Technical Development
> folks and ask them to PLEEZE make it possible to fine-tune whether bar
> lines run between staves or not? The most egregious problem with Finale
> is that one cannot create a final barline that connects all staves if one
> chooses to break barlines between staves elsewhere in the document.

I don't know what other fine tuning you would want besides this request.
I have had composers ask me for this but after looking through my choral
library (which is not extensive but has some rather reputable publishers
represented) I could not find an example in which the barlines were
broken in the score and solid in the final measure. If you insist on
doing it I was able to create a final barline rather easily in the shape
designer tool (.5 point for the first line and 3 point for the second
line). Be sure to uncheck Allow Horizontal Stretching. This shape can be
stretched verically on the page and positioned rather easily by nudging.
Don't turn the final barline on in the measure attributes and use the
thicker line to hide the thin final line.
Hope this helps
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 18:59:35 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 16:59:25 -0800 (PST)
From: Charles Nagel <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
CC: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Formatting multi-mvt. pts.
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

There's a quick-&-dirty solution that's inelegant but fine if time is
limited. Sometimes I set up the parts for each movement just the way I
want them, tweaked and indented, etc--and then in the page layout tool
move the top system to the bottom of the page BELOW where the previous
movements ends on its page. Then print the first movement, send the same
piece of paper through the printer again for the second movement, etc.
This is also O.K. for including musical examples as footnotes at the
bottom of a page of a word-processor document. It looks great; if
someone asks how you did it, you can always adroitly change the subject.
charlie nagel
Vashon Island, WA

On Wed, 25 Jan 1995, WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD wrote:

>
> On Tue, 24 Jan 1995, Paul Paterson wrote:
>
> > In working with multi-movement works, e.g. suites, I have been treating
> > each mvt. as a separate document. This has obvious advantages when working
> > with the score but it results in the parts for each mvt. being produced as
> > separate documents. In some instances it be would preferable to print a
> > mvt. partway down a page after the conclusion of the previous one. Is
> > there a method for doing this other than resorting to the creative use of
> > paper cutter, whiteout and photocopier?
>
> Tom Ginsberg's idea of using eps files works if you own Freehand or
> Illustrator. I have often pasted the first few measures of a movement
> onto the tail of the previous movement. I then create the proper space at
> the end of the movement by adding space to the last system of the first
> movement in the page layout window. Of course you have to adjust the
> indent of the first system of the next movement and adjust the layout
> again. Then in the next movement force all the systems not appearing at
> the end of the previous movment onto a separate page by adding a large
> amount to the space under the last system included in the previous
> movment.
>
> As I wrote this I realized that the explanation is really more complex
> than the procedure. If you still have questions I'll explain more fully.
> The final wrinkle is that to create parts, I often paste all of the
> movements together into a giant document (too large to work with
> practically speaking) for part extraction. I throw this document away
> after extracting the parts.
> *******************************
> * Larry Worster *
> * The Full Measure *
> * Boulder, CO 80303 *
> * (303) 494-3159 *
> * [email protected] *
> *******************************
>
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 19:03:00 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 18:03:31 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Ties, Engraving standards
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I'd have to agree that while somewhat difficult to configure the ties
feature actually works fairly well. I even have settings which avoid most
dots whether the note is on a line or a space. I'm not always satisfied
with my ties and sometimes resort to slurs instead. Slurs generally work
so well that I don't worry about the ties.

On the issue of engraving standards being made the default in Finale,
Kellia, did you ever use Pro Composer? Now *there* was a program that had
its mind made up for you on every issue of spacing and layout and the
results were *horrible*. I wouldn't give up the flexibility of Finale for
a program that thought it knew what spacing should be used. Music is just
too complex a language for a program to decide for me what the spacing
and layout should be in all situations. I don't feel that the defaults in
Finale are *that* bad. The options in the metatool layouts work in over
75% of the music and require only a minimum of adjustments in many other
cases.

By the way I don't want to drink champagne out of plastic cups. If music
is worth being played it is worth being set in an equally artistic manner.
IMHO the more elegant the typesetting, the truer the performance will be.
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 19:07:58 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 18:08:21 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Alternatives to Petrucci?
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Thu, 26 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:

> Can anyone recommend alternative fonts to Petrucci. Something that looks
> different and can be slotted into an existing file without too much
> tweaking. I know GoldenAge is an option.

I've not seen Golden Age but I hear they are killer fonts.
I use Gracenotes and Crecendos. (from Wendy Carlos Williams)

Casady and Greene
408-484-9228
Larry Worster
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 19:18:32 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 19:15:03 -0600 (CST)
From: Brian J Campbell <brianjc@jove.acs.unt.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Upgrade to WinFin 3.0
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950125191425.504D-100000@jove.acs.unt.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Wed, 25 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:

> I think it has been placed at at least one FTP site, perhaps FTP.SHSU.EDU.
> Please check past posts on this topic.

If you're thinking of my message, I placed the MAC 3.2.1 on FTP.UNT.EDU
and FTP.SHSU.EDU. I haven't seen the WinFin Version

Brian Campbell
/----------------\
|-----------------------------------|----------------------------------------|
|STUCK at UNT Department of Music |INTERNET: brianjc@jove.acs.unt.edu |
|in lovely Denton, Texas, USA |Snail:526 Alegre Vista;Denton, TX 76205 |
|Jazz/Arranging/Comp/Saxophone/Winds|Voice: (817) 382-7131 |
|-----------(It's not a town, just an Incredible Simulation)-----------------|
\__________________________________________________________________/

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 20:51:41 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab4cbf990402100427aa@[198.59.4.202]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 19:56:57 -0700
To: <[email protected]>, <[email protected]>
From: [email protected] (Ofer Ben-Amots)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: That 3.2.1 updater again,

Hi David,

Five minutes ago I found the 3.2.1 updater in my attachments folder.
It was e-mailed by Henry Howey of SHSU. Thanx anyway and keep in touch.

-- Ofer

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
| Ofer Ben-Amots |
| The Colorado College |
| Music Department |
| Tel: 719-389-6555 |
| Fax: 719-389-6862 |
| [email protected] |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 03:22:15 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Hallo everybody, I have read about FINALE 3.2.1 updater located in FTP.UNT.EDU
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 10:21:2 GMT
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

and FTP.SHSU.EDU. I made a FTP connection via FETCH Macintosh client

program but
I didn't found the UPDATER. Could someone, (VERY PLEASEEE !!!), tell me in

which directory to search in? THANKS!
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 03:22:37 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Return-Path: <yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il>
From: Yuval Shay-El <yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <9501260922.AA00615@cyclone.tau.ac.il>
Subject: A bug in WinFin 3.0 Midi export?
To: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 11:22:53 +0200 (IST)
CC: yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il (Yuval Shay-El)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

When saving a file as a midi file some of the some of the dynamic
expressions disappear. In particular accents ( > ) don't have an
effect on the coressponding notes in the Midi file, while they did
increase the note volume when the mus file was played through Finale.
Stacatoes (.), on the other hand, did shorten the note durations in the
Midi file. Crescendoes, or diminuendoes, created by the midi tool (not
as a staff expression), have also "disappeared" from the midi file. Is
it a bug, or am I doing something wrong?

Yuval Shay-El

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 04:34:10 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a good copyist
From: [email protected] (Ana Kellia Ramares)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Wed, 25 Jan 95 22:09:24 PST

Basinski,

SInce you NEVER get straight what I mean by my posts, so I wish you would
stop even bothering to respond.

First of all, someone mentioned earlier that it would not be legal for
him to give away files containing third party fonts because the font
designer has the copyright to them. That is why I mentioned it.

Don Rice is not the issue, because he is not the only font designer in
the world. And it is a low blow of you to accuse me of singling him out.

I am not saying that font designers should not have copyright. Quite the
contrary, it is the fact that I recognize that they have copyright and
expect to be paid that it adds another layer of cost, which did not exist
in the days before computerized notation.

It is simple economics that a professional copyist who has made the major
financial investment in Finale, plus the time investment in learning this
unwieldy program, learning engraving standards and tweaking the program
to try to meet them, and who approaches music copying as a fine art form
is going to factor that time and money investment into his or her prices
as far as the market (or union guidelines) will allow. Whenever a skill
category gets formalized through unions, trade groups, professional
organizations and recognized standards, price increases follow.

In fact, someone else on this list mentioned that Finale copying is a
"turf which should be protected." Part of protecting that turf is the
grouping of like minded people who hold themselves out to the public as
having a specialized knowledge that lay people don't have, and we who use
their services pay a premium for it. That is what the ABA, and the AMA
are about.

Font designers form another layer of value added to the process. Are
copyists and font desginers deserving of compensation? Of course they
are. But the whole thing that got this discussion started what that the
notation programs were supposed to be able to help composers who wanted
to to be able to bypass the use of such professionals. Unfortunately,
that has not been the case, thus often eliminating the choice between
using a professional or not.

I wanted a program that would help me produce a good quality score. I'm
not interested in engraving as a fine art. But now I find that if I want
a scroe presentable for competitions, school auditions or anything of the
like, I *have* to go to a pro, because I don't have the time or the
inclination to spend years tweaking Finale. I am a composer and singer,
not a copyist. However, I don't have alot of money, and I am sure that is
the case with alot of unknown composers. And I have to use the pro
because computerized scores are pretty well expected now.

Yes, *I* would probably have used a copyist in the pen and ink days as
well. But, let me ask those more experienced copyists out there to answer
this. Didn't your mere switch to computerized notation justify a higher
price over your pen and ink days, at least once you became used to your
program?

Yes, the program and the professionals who are proficient at it are
raising the standards. But for those of us who don't need a score to be a
work of "Fine art," those pricey standards are a hindrance to getting our
scores realized.

I believe Lamont Downs provided you with an example.

So, Basinski, take that condescending, lecturing tone you always take
with me and put it where the sun don't shine and then go kiss a cactus!

Kellia
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 07:32:48 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 06:33:31 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Midi playback
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Thu, 26 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:

> It has just occurred to me how to (easily) get midi active trills and other
> decorative events in Finale. (something that is simple to do in Overture)
> Enter your trill (live or whatever) on one layer. Hide it. Enter the full
> value note with its trill symbol on another layer and give that note a midi
> note on value of zero. Trouble will occur if you use allotments to space
> the bar but otherwise all sorts of midi activity could go on 'behind' the
> written notes.

Another way to do this is by putting the trills in a staff which is
optimized out of the score. To do this first create the score with and
extra staff for the ornament playback. After entering all the score notes
optimize the extra staff out of the score and then go back and enter the
notes using your trick to get the score notes which you don't want to
play to be aurally invisible.
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 08:54:27 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 06:54:01 pst
From: "Blake Hodgetts" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Midi playback

>On Thu, 26 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:

>> It has just occurred to me how to (easily) get midi active trills and other
>> decorative events in Finale. (something that is simple to do in Overture)
>> Enter your trill (live or whatever) on one layer. Hide it. Enter the full
>> value note with its trill symbol on another layer and give that note a midi
>> note on value of zero. Trouble will occur if you use allotments to space
>> the bar but otherwise all sorts of midi activity could go on 'behind' the
>> written notes.

>Another way to do this is by putting the trills in a staff which is
>optimized out of the score. To do this first create the score with and
>extra staff for the ornament playback. After entering all the score notes
>optimize the extra staff out of the score and then go back and enter the
>notes using your trick to get the score notes which you don't want to
>play to be aurally invisible.

How do you "optimize out" non-empty staves (i.e., those staves containing the
realization of the ornaments)? It has been my experience that optimization will
remove only staves containing no entries.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Blake Hodgetts / "Life is the only *
Musician / thing we have * [email protected]
Eugene, Oregon / worth living" *
Opinions represented above are mine, not my employer's
-----------------------------------------------------------

The following is an attached File item from cc:Mail. It contains
information that had to be encoded to ensure successful transmission
through various mail systems. To decode the file use the UUDECODE
program.
--------------------------------- Cut Here ---------------------------------
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end

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 09:35:12 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Andrew Zinck)
Subject: Re: Finale for Windows 3.0.1 updater
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 10:17:09 -0500
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>

In article <[email protected]>, Meredith wrote:
> I downloaded the Windows 3.0.1 updater from AOL and posted it to
> alt.binaries.sounds.utilities. It's over 1.2Mb uuencoded so I won't send it
> to the list. I'll try uploading it to a ftp site if someone would suggest
> a good one.

Thank you! Thank you! How about winftp.cica.indiana.edu (one of the
big Windows sites)? Well, regardless of where you decide to upload it,
don't forget to let us know!

Andrew M. Zinck | "They're funny things, Accidents.
University of Toronto | You never have them
Internet: [email protected] | until you're having them."
*PGP key available on request* | --Eeyore

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 10:04:14 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 11:05:26 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu (John C. Werner)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Who owns files/Ties

>In article <[email protected]> ([email protected])
>wrote on Re: Who owns data file?/Ties
>
>> As for the ties issue, they are thoroughly and completely inadequate.
>No
>> changing of the settings improves them. In fact, I would argue that any
>> change from the default makes them worse, because the Postscript Settings
>> for t
>ies (the only ones that matter, btw, if you use postscript) don't do
>> what they are supposed to do--or at least what the manual implies that they
>> do. The tie feature of Finale is BROKE BROKE BROKE, and we can only hope
>> that someday they fix it.
>>
>> Robert
>
>Well, that is going a bit far. I don't know which platform you are using, but
>on
>
>the Mac I have devised ties settings that work quite well for most musical
>situations. I would never call them "thoroughly and completely inadequate".
>There is one point, however, that I wish Coda could do something about (Eric?
>Tech Support? Development, are you listening?): the tie settings I use cause
>the
>
>ties to collide with the dot on dotted notes when those notes fall on a line
>(rather than on a space). They look perfect otherwise, but I have to manually
>adjust ties that follow dotted line-notes, a great pain in the rear
>(especially
>in compound meters!). It would be nice if there were a configurable option for
>"ties after dots" which took into account whether the notes are on lines or on
>spaces. I have also noticed that ties on whole notes are placed too close to
>the
>
>notehead; Finale needs to be aware of the different sizes of noteheads (this
>should be configurable as well). Basically, there should be a whole dialog
>box's
>
>worth of settings for Ties, not just a couple of fields.
>
>If anyone has a further interest in this, I will share with him/her my tie
>settings, arrived at after considerable experimentation and the printing of
>dozens of examples.
>

Thanks for this discussion. I would like to make some suggestions, about
settings and see if I get any response. I, too, have not been satisfied
with default settings for ties the Mac Version 3.2. Using the Mac and a
Personal Laserwriter NT, I have found some settings that work for ties most
situations, and I haven't run into a problem with dotted notes, yet, with
these settings, although I still have limited experience. I do not publish
music and I'm most interested in readable music for our ensemble and for
piano music. Using EVPU's, in Postscript Options, in "Tie Ends box", set
->H: at 8. In "Ties" box, Starting Point ->H: is -20. Ending point ->H:
is 20. I leave all other settings at 0 in "Tie Ends" and "Ties". Under
Music Options, "Tie" box, I set ->H: at -20, ^V: at 24 and arc height at
25. I arrived at these settings through no logic and I don't have the
engraving manuals to which everyone serious about this business refers. I
merely offer them up as possibly more readable than default settings. I
should remark that these settings were difficult to make because in order
to see some approximation of the final result, I had to keep switching to a
"Postscript Preview", and even then, the printed result sometimes had
nuances I could not detect on the screen. I have only done a few
single-line instrument scores with these settings, and I still have to
check out what happens with piano scores and with multiple parts on the
same staff.

Chris Werner, pediatric cardiologist, music lover, Brown University
father, clarinetist, singer, accompanist, non-sailor. Medical School
Providence, RI
John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu (401)444-5984

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 10:17:07 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 11:16:27 EST
From: [email protected] (Rich Rinehart)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a good copyist

Basinski
Kellia

How about you both say your sorry so we can get on with it?
-rich

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rich Rinehart | phone: 216-433-5211
NASA Lewis Research Center | email: [email protected]
Cleveland, OH | http://warhol.lerc.nasa.gov/rich.html
"Best damn mail handler I ever had"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 10:24:17 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 10:24:54 -0600 (CST)
From: Jay Brian Kummer <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Windows Finale to Mac Finale file compatibility...
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Hi:

What would be the best way to import a WinFinale 3.0 file into the
current version of MacFinale (if possible)? A few tests reveal that there
are some problems doing this.

Thanks.

Jay Brian Kummer
Software Engineer Searching for Slack
Department of Cellular Biology
Medical College of Wisconsin
8701 Watertown Plank Road
Milwaukee, WI 53226
[email protected]

\\=========================\\=============================\\===============\\
// Jay Brian Kummer // If you act like a dumbshit, // VMS is one of //
\\ Email: \\ people will treat you like \\ the signs of \\
// [email protected] // an equal. JR 'Bob' Dobbs // Armageddon. //
\\=========================\\=============================\\===============\\

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 11:04:51 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 09:07:05 -0800
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Kevin Moore)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Formatting multi-mvt. pts.

>EPS files - Illustrator and Pagemaker are the tools I use for putting
>together multi-movement works. This allows the most flexibility for page
>layout without the side-effects.

This brings up one of the features I wish Finale would **borrow* from
Mosaic and Overture.

In Mosaic, instead of creating an separate EPS document of the whole page,
you simply type Command-3 and draw a box around any part of the page; then
go to Pagemaker and type Command-V. That's it. It's also very nice for
making unwanted clefs, time sig's etc. "invisible. You just take a section
of blank staff lines and paste those over whatever you want to hide.

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 11:27:00 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 8:50:04 -0500 (EST)
From: Ensign Gig Line <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: Layout of Mirrored measures

Och, Rabbie Burrrrrrrrrns, sure an' the mirror tuil is aunly meant fer
vairtical measures. 'Tis ane aufuil shairtcomin', tae be suir....
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 11:28:50 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 8:53:25 -0500 (EST)
From: Ensign Gig Line <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: A bug in WinFin 3.0 Midi export?

I know just what you mean, Yuval. I use Cakewalk/Win as my sequencer, but
ity's much easier to use Finale's MIDI tool to paint in the
dynamics...which, when I open the file under Cakewalk, are found to have
disappeared.
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 11:38:59 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 12:36:31 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Finale Mail-list- Subscribe

Subscribe Finale Mail-list
[email protected]
Thanx
:-)
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 11:49:44 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 11:39:16 -0500 (EST)
From: Lieutenant (jg) Gig Line <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Value of a Copyist

I have been following this discussion for a while now, and I am still
waiting for someone to define just what "professional engraving standards"
are. The complaints about "Finale's defaults have nothing to do with" said
standards are meaningless, to me at any rate, until I can see an example of
where Finale diverges from the standards. It beams notes; puts seconds on
opposite sides of the stem; produces tapered slurs; etc. etc. etc. I've been
playing in community orchestras, and singing, for much of my life, and damn
if the music put before me doesn't look exactly like what Finale produces.
So please, WHAT is the complaint?
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 12:16:09 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 13:18:32 -0500 (EST)
From: "Meredith M. Williams" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Finale for Windows 3.0.1 updater
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

I just uploaded the updater to WINFTP.CICA.INDIANA.EDU. I don't know when it
will actually appear or where it will be - /pub/pc/win3/sounds maybe?
It's called fin302.exe.
Meredith
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 14:00:15 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 13:41:24 -0600
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: A bug in WinFin 3.0 Midi export?

Although I haven't tried MIDI file creation with WinFin 3.0, 2.* did the
same thing that Yuval discussed; it dropped the expression. Tempo was not
varying as it was in the performance, but was constant. I tried adjusting
the transcription tool settings (regarding expression) to no avail. Unless
all of us are missing something, I don't believe Coda expected us to need
performance expression in output MIDI files. That's understandable in a
sense. Finale has the transcription tool and HyperScribe for notational
purposes, not for creating tracks. There are better tools for sequencing.
Still, it would be nice to have your CakeWalk, and eat it too.
Lance Philip Strugar
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 14:24:50 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Robert Patterson <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale News Group <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Value of a Copyist
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 14:27:00 CST
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

<<I have been following this discussion for a while now, and I am still
waiting for someone to define just what "professional engraving standards"
are. The complaints about "Finale's defaults have nothing to do with" said
standards are meaningless, to me at any rate, until I can see an example of
where Finale diverges from the standards. It beams notes; puts seconds on
opposite sides of the stem; produces tapered slurs; etc. etc. etc. I've been

playing in community orchestras, and singing, for much of my life, and damn
if the music put before me doesn't look exactly like what Finale produces.
So please, WHAT is the complaint?>>

Ah, where to begin. These and many other topics have been the bread and
butter of this group since I joined about 6 months ago. First, I suggest
some reference works that may help you understand what the standards are.
They are the Ted Ross's "Art of Musical Engraving and Processing," Kurt
Stone's "Music Notation in the 20th Century," and Gardner Read's "Music
Notation" (primarily for its detailed exposition of standards for
"punctuation"--that is "note layout" for Finale-heads.) Of course, each
publishing house has its own standards, but these books get you in the ball
park.

What are specific Finale shortcomings?

A) Punctuation (read note layout) must be manually adjusted to acheive a
polished, engraved look.
B) Each beam must be manually examined and potentially adjusted to eliminate
what is called "wedges," that is small triangles that form between the beam,
the stem, and a staff line. Plus Finale's default settings do not provide
enough variability of beam angle for different situations, so one must
manually adjust each one for optimal results.
C) Stem length. This is related to beam angle. Again, Finale's default
settings do not provide enough variability, so quite often stem lengths must
be manually adjusted. (The Ross book contains lengthy discussions on beam
angle and stem length.)
D) Ties. Woefully inadequate in Finale. Engravers with hard-to-please
editors don't even use them--they use slur marks instead. Since I'm my own
editor, I use them but I curse them every time I do. Ross contains detailed
standards for tie shape, tie end placement and tie height, and Finale ties
are simply incapable of rendering them.
E) Slurs. Amazingly enough, the new Smart Slurs available in the latest Mac
versions are the first "Smart" shapes deserving the title, although they are
criminally slow in drawing. Up until v3.2, I would have argued that slurs
required painstaking editing to acheive engraver-quality, but I can no
longer make that claim. Unless I am mistaken, you still can't easily do
exotic slurs as are sometimes required in late-Romantic piano music, where
the slur must cross over the top staff from under the bottom or
vice-a-versa. (You can do them, but the shape and shading don't come out
right.)

The comments in the previous posting (quoted above) suggest what I have
argued from the start. Some people do not have the patience, need, or desire
to develop the eye for minute detail that an engraver requires. The poster
clearly has not taken the effort to observe the difference between
"engraved" and "legible." No settings are magical enough to compensate for
this lack of minutia-obsession, and work from such a source will be of
inferior quality. Those users with the engraver's mindset will either figure
out settings to satisfy themselves or refuse to use the tool. Thus their
interest in another person's settings will be for incremental benefit rather
than any strategic or even tactical benefit. Giving away settings in such a
context may give away something of value to the receiver, but its value is
limited, and--as a another previous poster suggested--what the giver gets is
an enhanced reputation plus the possibility of learning something useful in
return. Seems like a pretty good trade to me.

All this said, one or two of the war stories cited here are very irksome.
The one about the Cinci publisher who took the Finale templates and then
refused to hire their author for the job is horrible. What this person lost
was not the settings, per se (which would be of little use to users
inexperienced with Finale or with engraving or both), but any information
imparted to the unscrupulous thief about how to use the settings and the
Finale program itself. Essentially, the theiving publisher stole the
author's experience and knowledge, not his settings.

Robert
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 16:17:23 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Return-Path: <yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il>
From: Yuval Shay-El <yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <9501262217.AA01542@cyclone.tau.ac.il>
Subject: Re: A bug in WinFin 3.0 Midi export?
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 00:17:11 +0200 (IST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
> Although I haven't tried MIDI file creation with WinFin 3.0, 2.* did the
> same thing that Yuval discussed; it dropped the expression. Tempo was not
> varying as it was in the performance, but was constant. I tried adjusting
> the transcription tool settings (regarding expression) to no avail. Unless
> all of us are missing something, I don't believe Coda expected us to need
> performance expression in output MIDI files. That's understandable in a
> sense. Finale has the transcription tool and HyperScribe for notational
> purposes, not for creating tracks. There are better tools for sequencing.
> Still, it would be nice to have your CakeWalk, and eat it too.
> Lance Philip Strugar
>

I work with Finale in a different way, more in the traditional "composing
on paper" technique. First I enter the music with the speedy note tool,
and all the expression marks. The audio output is only used as an audible
sketch for a live performance. Now in Finale 2.0.1 dynamics such as ff, pp,
etc., and note articulations (., >, etc.) worked fine, AND WERE EXPORTED FINE
to a midi file. Crescendos were more of a problem. The Midi tool didn't
agree to deal with music entered "by hand" (and not by a transcription tool),
and the executable shapes were terible to deal with (still are). So the
solution I found was to do my best with Finale, then export the Midi file
to Cakewalk and do the rest so the piece sounds pretty good (usually
much better than most live performances--that's life). In Finale 3.0
the Midi tool is kind enough to let us improve the basic dynamics
done by the expression and articulation tools. However, as I mentioned in
my original post, some of these expressions disappear in the midi export.
Well, I guess it IS a bug. Does anyone from Coda read this news group?

Yuval

--
Yuval Shay-El
Department of Geophysics | Home address:
and Planetary Sciences | 19 Granados
Tel-Aviv University | Ramat Gan, 52326
Tel-Aviv 69978 | Israel
Israel |
Fax: 972-3-6409282 | Tel: 972-3-5741634
Tel: 972-3-6409120 |
e-mail: yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 16:22:25 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Robert Patterson <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale News Group <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: Formatting multi-mvt. pts.
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 16:25:00 CST
Message-ID: <[email protected]>


In this case I usually combine the extracted part into a single file (using
clip files). The procedure is
1. Extract orch. parts from each score file.
2. Paste each part together using clip files or with v3 just by opening the
two files simultaneously.
3. Be sure to leave a blank measure between each movement in the extracted
parts. You will use this to suppress bogus key sigs and time sigs. that may
appear at the end of each movement. (See "Courtesy key sigs" in the Finale
Encyclopedia for more details.)
----------
From: owner-finale
To: Finale
Subject: Formatting multi-mvt. pts.
Date: Tuesday, January 24, 1995 1:24PM

In working with multi-movement works, e.g. suites, I have been treating
each mvt. as a separate document. This has obvious advantages when working
with the score but it results in the parts for each mvt. being produced as
separate documents. In some instances it be would preferable to print a
mvt. partway down a page after the conclusion of the previous one. Is
there a method for doing this other than resorting to the creative use of
paper cutter, whiteout and photocopier?

Paul Paterson

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 16:28:39 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Robert Patterson <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale News Group <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Layout of Mirrored measures
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 16:29:00 CST
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

<<In the past I was able to move
excessive notes (*THERE ARE TOO MANY NOTES IN THE MEASURE... dialog box) to
the next measure without deleting the next measure's entries. The notes
would simply be added before letting me decide about my next step. In the
current version if you move extra notes to the next measure the old entries
are being deleted and replaced with those extra notes. I wish CODA would
let me decide if I want those entries deleted or not.>>

Hear, hear! Given the annoying nature of the dialog box to begin with, it is
doubly annoying that Coda changed its behavior (for no apparent reason).
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 18:18:56 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Lindsay Vickery <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: #s in Staff expression Tool
To: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 08:19:22 +0800 (WST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Lindsay Vickery: FinMac 3.2 and 3.0.1
Is anyone else having trouble with #s turning into 0s in the staff
expression tool. A friend brough it to my attention when he was writing
some chord symbols. And now I have it too!! He described a system of
writing a 1 at the beginning of the offending expression which made the 0
back into a #. But then he had to liquid paper the 1 out on the hard
copy. I tried this AND making the # up in petrucci and then attaching it
in the middle of the helvetica expression and neither work!!
Any ideas? Al also think I might have been unsubscribed as I've had no
mail for a while. I just subscribed again....I hope.
Thanks Folks
LV [email protected]
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 18:24:44 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected].edu.au>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 11:24:37 +1100
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected].edu.au (Claudio Pompili)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: reply to Ofer

Ofer wrote:

In my experience, the MIRROR TOOL is absolutly redundant.

I haven't had a need or care to use it but I'm still hoping that the day
will come....let's not be hasty...

On the other hand one of the nicest features of Finale has been eliminated
(since v3.0) for no apparent reason: In the past I was able to move
excessive notes (*THERE ARE TOO MANY NOTES IN THE MEASURE... dialog box) to
the next measure without deleting the next measure's entries.

I hadn't realised that this was the case and would certainly agree with
your concern. The expunging of what were once features, albeit sometimes
quirky, I think is a general problem and Coda really ought to canvas
feedback on lists like this or Compuserve etc before deleting options. My
lament was for the passing of the retrograde EMEL macros of FinMac 2.6.3
versions. One many of the EMEL macros were incorporated into the menus of
the Mass Mover Tool they left off the retrograde one (I suppose because the
'felt' for lack of interest). It was one of the quirkiest (it did wild
things to tuplets etc) but neatest tools going as far as I was concerned.

Also, the advent of the EMEL macros suggested that Coda were looking
forward to an 'open' system and allowing for users to write their own macro
code. Alas, this never eventuated but it has to be the way to go.....

Regards, Claudio

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Claudio Pompili
Head e-mail:
[email protected].edu.au
Music Dept, Univ of New England wk tel: +61-(0)67-73-2911
Armidale NSW 2351, Australia hm tel/fax: +61-(0)67-75 2433

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 19:52:59 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <v01510100ab4e05a2071c@[199.4.98.44]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 18:10:50 -0800
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Dylan Schorer)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: #s in Staff expression Tool

>Is anyone else having trouble with #s turning into 0s in the staff
>expression tool. A friend brough it to my attention when he was writing
>some chord symbols. And now I have it too!! He described a system of
>writing a 1 at the beginning of the offending expression which made the 0
>back into a #. But then he had to liquid paper the 1 out on the hard
>copy. I tried this AND making the # up in petrucci and then attaching it
>in the middle of the helvetica expression and neither work!!

Try typing # twice.

If you want: D A D F# A D
enter: D A D F## A D



Dylan Schorer
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 20:14:40 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 19:14:48 -0700 (MST)
From: [email protected] (Stephen Jones)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: #s in Staff expression Tool
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

The Staff Expression Tool replaces the # sign with the currently defined
playback value in the Text Expression Designer dialog. Your printed staff
expression is 0s because the currently defined playback value is 0. (Click
the button "show playback options" and you will confirm this.)

If you want to print #s, type ##s.


>Lindsay Vickery wrote:
>Is anyone else having trouble with #s turning into 0s in the staff
>expression tool?


Stephen Jones

Department of Music, Brigham Young University
P.O. Box 26410, Provo, UT 84602-6410

(801) 378-4135 (voice w/ phone mail) (801) 378-5973 (FAX)
[email protected] (e-mail)


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 20:32:17 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 21:32:54 -0500 (EST)
From: "STEPHANIE W. WILSON" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Henry Howey <[email protected]>
Subject: still attached?
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950126213056.19160C-100000@hamlet>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I haven't gotten *any* messages from the list in about a week. Am I
still "attached" or did something go wrong? I'm a greenhorn with this
electronic stuff, so I'd appreciate it if someone could tell me what's
happened (if possible) and how to fix it.

Thank you in advance.

Stephanie
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 21:09:29 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 21:06:01 -0600 (CST)
From: David Carson Berry <dcb0001@jove.acs.unt.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: #s in Staff expression Tool
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950126210501.22137B-100000@jove.acs.unt.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Regarding the problem with the "#" symbol becoming a "0" when entering it
alone via the Staff Expression tool (see original message below):

Of course, this is due to the "Replace Number Sign With..." feature (or
however it is worded exactly). As mentioned, I suppose one can avoid
this by prefixing the symbol in some way, but that results in having to
erase the extraneous character later. As the graphics editor for two
music-theory journals, I have encountered this problem frequently,
especially when attaching editorial musica ficta markings or figured-bass
symbols to older music. I have tended to use the Text Block tool to
enter these, either in page or scroll view, depending on what was most
appropriate in the context of the example or score I was producing.
Alternately, I have at times used another font that I have which closely
resembles Petrucci, but uses a keyboard stroke other than shift-3 for the
sharp/pound sign. This is not ideal however, since there are differences
(no matter how slight) between the two fonts' version of the symbol, and
for this reason I do not do this except under certain circumstances. The
Text Block entry, on the other hand, would be a perfect solution except
for its lack of entry efficiency vis a vis Staff Expression entry.

Any other suggestions?

David Carson Berry
University of North Texas
dcb0001@jove.acs.unt.edu

On Fri, 27 Jan 1995, Lindsay Vickery wrote:

> Lindsay Vickery: FinMac 3.2 and 3.0.1
> Is anyone else having trouble with #s turning into 0s in the staff
> expression tool. A friend brough it to my attention when he was writing
> some chord symbols. And now I have it too!! He described a system of
> writing a 1 at the beginning of the offending expression which made the 0
> back into a #. But then he had to liquid paper the 1 out on the hard
> copy. I tried this AND making the # up in petrucci and then attaching it
> in the middle of the helvetica expression and neither work!!
> Any ideas? Al also think I might have been unsubscribed as I've had no
> mail for a while. I just subscribed again....I hope.
> Thanks Folks
> LV [email protected]
>
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 21:57:12 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab4e1eb000021004875c@[198.59.4.202]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 21:02:36 -0700
To: <[email protected]>, <[email protected]>
From: [email protected] (Ofer Ben-Amots)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: still attached?

STEPHANIE W. WILSON Write:
>
>I haven't gotten *any* messages from the list in about a week. Am I
>still "attached" or did something go wrong? I'm a greenhorn with this
>electronic stuff, so I'd appreciate it if someone could tell me what's
>happened (if possible) and how to fix it.
>
>Thank you in advance.
>
>Stephanie
>[email protected]
>
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Stephanie,

The same has happened to many good and lawabiding members of this list.

In the last week there have been close to hundred messages (approx.) If you
suspect that you have been removed from Finale mailing list you should
simply
resubscribe.

Send a mail message to: [email protected]

With the exact message:

SUBSCRIBE Finale "Your Real Name in Quotes"

If it happens again or too frequently, you probably want to create a macro :-}

-- Ofer

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
| Ofer Ben-Amots |
| The Colorado College |
| Music Department |
| Tel: 719-389-6555 |
| Fax: 719-389-6862 |
| [email protected] |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 22:01:14 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 21:01:38 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: #s in Staff expression Tool
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Thu, 26 Jan 1995, David Carson Berry wrote:

> As the graphics editor for two
> music-theory journals, I have encountered this problem frequently,
> especially when attaching editorial musica ficta markings or figured-bass
> symbols to older music. I have tended to use the Text Block tool to
> enter these, either in page or scroll view, depending on what was most
> appropriate in the context of the example or score I was producing.
>
> Any other suggestions?

Yes!!! I recently discoved the best method for mixing fonts in Finale. Of
all places in the staff expressions tool but not in the text creation
function. Use the Shape Designer instead. One can mix fonts within a text
block (as we should be able to do in a text block on the page) in the
shape designer. A hard to find fact about this function is that within a
text block in the shape designer, font choices work sequentially. Choose
Palatino Bold 14, type D, choose Rameau 20 (put out by Finale for figured
bass symbols) type the # (a "s" in Rameau. I think that will look as good
as anything you are currently using. You can create the letters in
separate text blocks for absolute control as to their positioning. The
problem with mixing the sharp in Petrucci with other fonts is that the
baseline is too low. By the way this works great for creating the initial
tempo (Allegro q=123, where the "q" is a quarter note). If I was doing a
lot of this I would create a library of symbols to import into my
documents or store in my template. After all there are a limited number
of possibilities for combinations. Hope this helps.
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 22:02:53 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 21:03:34 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Midi playback
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

> >Another way to do this is by putting the trills in a staff which is
> >optimized out of the score. To do this first create the score with and
> >extra staff for the ornament playback. After entering all the score notes
> >optimize the extra staff out of the score and then go back and enter the
> >notes using your trick to get the score notes which you don't want to
> >play to be aurally invisible.
>
> How do you "optimize out" non-empty staves (i.e., those staves containing the
> realization of the ornaments)? It has been my experience that optimization will
> remove only staves containing no entries.

Optimize *before* entering the trill playback notes. At that point the
staves are empty. Optimizing freezes the page view.
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 23:18:07 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 00:09:17 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: A bug in WinFin 3.0 Midi export?

Odd but true: In ver 2.2 of WinFin, I couldn't get MIDI tool changes in
DURATION to save into a MIDI file. Swing, for example, wouldn't save into
a MIDI file. NOW...in 3.0.2, the modified DURATIONS will save, but the
DYNAMICS won't. Go figure!
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 01:36:14 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 08:35:53 +0100
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: terje.[email protected] (Terje Winther)
Reply-To: [email protected], terje.[email protected]
Subject: Re: Distance between staves

Michael Eckert wrote on Wed, 25 Jan 1995 12:11:09:
>4. Has anyone tried the "tricks" for getting high-resolution printing on
>a StyleWriter (making the music 5 times larger and then selecting 20% in
>Print Preferences)? I couldn't get this to work with a piece where the
>basic size was set at 76%, either by simply multiplying that percentage
>by 5 or by the method using the page dimensions.

I used to do this with an earlier version of Finale for Mac (v. 2.1 or
something), due to the fact that Petrucci was PostScript only.
It always worked fine - even with an odd percentage startpoint.
Now, I am using FinMac v. 2.6.something with TrueType and the original
StyleWriter. I always use the appropiate percentage directly.
Perfect output.

What exactly isn't working? What does it print?

(: tw.

Terje Winther
Komponist/Produksjonskonsulent Composer/Producer
Ny Musikk I.S.C.M. (Norwegian section of the
International Society for Contemporary Music
Ny Musikks Komponistgruppe (NMK) New Music Composers' Group
E-mail: [email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 01:36:39 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 08:36:20 +0100
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: terje.[email protected] (Terje Winther)
Reply-To: [email protected], terje.[email protected]
Subject: Re: Alternatives to Petrucci?

>Can anyone recommend alternative fonts to Petrucci. Something that looks
>different and can be slotted into an existing file without too much
>tweaking. I know GoldenAge is an option.

Susato by Ergo Sum in Germany is in much use in Europe.


(: tw.

Terje Winther
Komponist/Produksjonskonsulent Composer/Producer
Ny Musikk I.S.C.M. (Norwegian section of the
International Society for Contemporary Music
Ny Musikks Komponistgruppe (NMK) New Music Composers' Group
E-mail: [email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 01:39:45 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 00:41:40 -0700 (MST)
From: Jim Laurendeau <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Windows Finale to Mac Finale file compatibility...
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


On Thu, 26 Jan 1995, Jay Brian Kummer wrote:

> Hi:
>
> What would be the best way to import a WinFinale 3.0 file into the
> current version of MacFinale (if possible)? A few tests reveal that there
> are some problems doing this.
>
> Thanks.


When saving the file choose file type "Enigma Transportable File", then
make sure this is selected when opening the file on the other computer.
(This is provided that you save the file in some way that is readable by
both computers)

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 06:10:37 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 12:05:36 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alvaro Torrente <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: #s in Staff expression Tool
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.91.950127120006.17155A-100000@blue.csi.cam.ac.uk>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


On Thu, 26 Jan 1995, WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD wrote:

> Yes!!! I recently discoved the best method for mixing fonts in Finale. Of
> all places in the staff expressions tool but not in the text creation
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 08:20:29 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 09:21:53 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu (John C. Werner)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: still attached?

I saw a message on a local Brown Univ. listing that indicated that the
membership to this mailing list had been accidentally wiped out. The only
answer is to subscribe again.

Chris Werner, pediatric cardiologist, music lover, Brown University
father, clarinetist, singer, accompanist, non-sailor. Medical School
Providence, RI
John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu Voice:
(401)444-5984

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 08:25:53 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 9:13:51 -0500 (EST)
From: Lieutenant (jg) Gig Line <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], terje.[email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Alternatives to Petrucci?

I've heard of teh Susato font but have never seen it. It isn't that icky
font that all of Debussy's music seems to be set in, is it? 8-) Can someone
provide an example for me? I've asked in vain on the America Online Finale
forum...
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 09:04:55 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 95 07:08:28 pst
From: "Blake Hodgetts" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re[2]: #s in Staff expression Tool

On Thu, 26 Jan 1995, WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD wrote:

> Yes!!! I recently discoved the best method for mixing fonts in Finale. Of
> all places in the staff expressions tool but not in the text creation
> function. Use the Shape Designer instead.

I have also found the Chord Suffix designer very handy for this. You can mix
symbols and fonts freely, and the symbols are very easy to enter and position.
If you are not using the chord symbols for anything else, you might consider
this option.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Blake Hodgetts / "Life is the only *
Musician / thing we have * [email protected]
Eugene, Oregon / worth living" *
Opinions represented above are mine, not my employer's
-----------------------------------------------------------

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end

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 09:19:31 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 95 07:19:59 pst
From: "Blake Hodgetts" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re[2]: Midi playback

>> >Another way to do this is by putting the trills in a staff which is
>> >optimized out of the score. To do this first create the score with and
>> >extra staff for the ornament playback. After entering all the score notes
>> >optimize the extra staff out of the score and then go back and enter the
>> >notes using your trick to get the score notes which you don't want to
>> >play to be aurally invisible.
>
>> How do you "optimize out" non-empty staves (i.e., those staves containing the
>> realization of the ornaments)? It has been my experience that optimization
will
>> remove only staves containing no entries.

>Optimize *before* entering the trill playback notes. At that point the
>staves are empty. Optimizing freezes the page view.

If you do this, you will have to have your layout completely finalized before
entering these notes; if you have to adjust the layout, you will have problems
with the formerly optimized staves, and you won't be able to hide the playback
staves unless you delete out the "invisible" notes.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Blake Hodgetts / "Life is the only *
Musician / thing we have * [email protected]
Eugene, Oregon / worth living" *
Opinions represented above are mine, not my employer's
-----------------------------------------------------------

The following is an attached File item from cc:Mail. It contains
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end

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 10:30:16 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 09:27:46 -0700 (MST)
From: Mark Basinski - UA School of Music <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Midi playback
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

>>Optimize *before* entering the trill playback notes. At that point the
>>staves are empty. Optimizing freezes the page view.
>
>If you do this, you will have to have your layout completely finalized before
>entering these notes; if you have to adjust the layout, you will have problems
>with the formerly optimized staves, and you won't be able to hide the playback
>staves unless you delete out the "invisible" notes.

In cases where you really have specific playback needs, I think it isn't a bad
idea to make a separate copy of the score to diddle for perfect playback.
This probably only would work if you can complete the basic score in a form to
be printed, the then make a separate copy to play back from. I realize that
this might be impractical if you want to change things (modifying 2 separate
copies is NOT fun) but in some cases it might simplify things

Mark Basinski University of Arizona
Adjunct Assistant Professor School of Music

[email protected] (602) 621-7470

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 10:34:24 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: "Louis Pape" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 10:34:17 CST
Subject: Re: still attached?
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

> Date sent: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 09:21:53 -0500
> To: [email protected], [email protected]
> From: John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu (John C. Werner)
> Send reply to: [email protected], John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu
> Subject: Re: still attached?
> I saw a message on a local Brown Univ. listing that indicated that the
> membership to this mailing list had been accidentally wiped out. The only
> answer is to subscribe again.
>
> Chris Werner, pediatric cardiologist, music lover, Brown University
> father, clarinetist, singer, accompanist, non-sailor. Medical School
> Providence, RI
> John_Werner@postoffice.brown.edu Voice:
> (401)444-5984
>
> Oh, so that's what happened! I certainly wondered! Thanks a lot
for the info, and I'm sure many others also thank you too. Louis Pape
>
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 11:28:41 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 11:28:46 -0600
From: [email protected].edu (Mahler)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected].edu>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Help!

Please help me! Can someone please send me a detailed explanation of how to set
a different sound to each staff, so I can hear my work on something other than
the piano setting? I own a MacIntosh Color Classic and a Yamaha PSR-510
Multi-Timbral Keyboard. I just can't seem to get any other sound than the
number 1 piano setting. Thanks in advance.

Take It Easy,
Brian Mahler
[email protected].edu
Sioux City, Iowa
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 11:46:25 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 12:48:29 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Who owns files/Ties

Chris Werner writes...

>>I should remark that these settings were difficult to make because in order
to see some approximation of the final result, I had to keep switching to a
"Postscript Preview", and even then, the printed result sometimes had nuances
I could not detect on the screen. <<

If you zoom in to about 800% before you do PS preview, the preview will be at
that %. If you miss any nuances then, you either have a really small screen
or you need some glasses <g>.

Tom Ginsberg
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 11:46:39 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 12:44:07 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Formatting multi-mvt. pts.

Kevin Moore writes

>>In Mosaic, instead of creating an separate EPS document of the whole page,
you simply type Command-3 and draw a box around any part of the page;then go
to Pagemaker and type Command-V. That's it. It's also very nice for making
unwanted clefs, time sig's etc. "invisible. You just take a section of blank
staff lines and paste those over whatever you want to hide.<<

THis sounds like a PICT file to me. Personally I have found that PM acts
quirky when I go to print if I have too many little pict files that aren't
put in with the place command (so that they're individual files). I don't
think pict's print as well either and I cant edit them in Illustrator.

Tom

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 11:50:22 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Dale E Newton <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 11:50:52 -0600
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Font question

I temporarily ported my recent copy of Finale 3.03 (Mac) to my
powerbook for an out of town project over the weekend. (No flames
here, I will keep only one copy of the program on my home system when
I get back). Problem is I forgot my manual and evidently also how to
configure the Petrucci And Seville music fonts. When I boot the
program neither music fonts (Petrucci) or the Guitar font (Seville)
come up. They are ghosted in my font configuration requestor. I'm
only a recent Finale user and probably missing something important.
Is it possible I didn't get an essential program folder copied?
Anyone know where Finale looks for these fonts and how to access them
within the program?

Thanks.

email please.
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 11:58:53 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 12:56:28 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: #s in Staff expression Tool

>>Regarding the problem with the "#" symbol becoming a "0" when entering it
alone via the Staff Expression tool....<<

I'm surprised nobody has chimed in with the simple solution (which is in the
manuals.. I think) so here it goes:
Just type ## if you want a single # to appear ie. to get #5 you would type
##5 - That'll do it !!

Tom Ginsberg
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 13:18:03 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 10:48:33 -0800 (PST)
From: [email protected] (Harold Owen)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Formatting multi-mvt. pts.
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Paul Paterson writes:

"In working with multi-movement works, e.g. suites, I have been treating
each mvt. as a separate document. This has obvious advantages when working
with the score but it results in the parts for each mvt. being produced as
separate documents. In some instances it would be preferable to print a
mvt. partway down a page after the conclusion of the previous one. Is
there a method for doing this other than resorting to the creative use of
paper cutter, whiteout and photocopier?"

One nice thing about the Layout Tool is that you can begin the music
anywhere down the page. When my parts have just a few lines of music for
the end of one movement and more than half of the page is blank, I like to
use the page for the beginning of the next movement. The way I do it is to
print the page in question, then put the page back in the printer to print
the beginning of the next movement ON THE SAME PAGE. No cutting and
pasting, no white-out. Try it.

Hal Owen
University of Oregon

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 13:45:44 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 95 14:45:05 EST
From: [email protected] (Rich Rinehart)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Midi playback

>Mark Basinski writes:
>In cases where you really have specific playback needs, I think it isn't a bad
>idea to make a separate copy of the score to diddle for perfect playback.
>This probably only would work if you can complete the basic score in a form to
>be printed, the then make a separate copy to play back from. I realize that
>this might be impractical if you want to change things (modifying 2 separate
>copies is NOT fun) but in some cases it might simplify things

I find that using a real sequencing package (like Cakewalk) for playback
enables you to do neat tricks to the work, that may be too time consuming
to do in Finale. Such as writing a macro to slightly and quickly randomize
note starting times, durations, and velocities. Of course as Mark noted,
it's important to do that once the Finale copy is near complete.
-rich

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rich Rinehart | phone: 216-433-5211
NASA Lewis Research Center | email: [email protected]
Cleveland, OH | http://warhol.lerc.nasa.gov/rich.html
"Best damn mail handler I ever had"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 14:14:31 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 15:15:09 -0500 (EST)
From: Peter Temko <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Inexpensive Finale
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Hello -

A while back among the least expensive places to get Finale was at the
University of Northern Colorado bookstore - they even had a mail order
catalog, I think. I've lost the address and all the catalogs.

Does anyone know if they are still mail-ordering, if they are still cheap
- and if so, does anyone have the 800 number?

Thanks in advance.

Pete Temko
Prof. of Music
University of Tennessee at Chattanooga
([email protected])
**************************************
* Author Ann Lamott on writer's block*
* "If your husband/wife locks you out*
* of the house, you are not having a *
* problem with the door! *
**************************************

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 14:55:27 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 14:52:01 -0600 (CST)
From: David Carson Berry <dcb0001@jove.acs.unt.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: finale message-post <[email protected]>
Subject: Two Questions
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950127144038.21666B-100000@jove.acs.unt.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Due to being off the list during an e-mail address change I have missed a
couple of things I have seen allusions to recently.

(1) Where may one obtain the figured-bass font "Rameau 20" (or whatever it
is called)? For those that use it, what symbols are allowed -- that is,
I'm sure it can vertically stack "6-4-2" but what about the various ways
of indicating raised or lowered intervals, etc.

(2) Is there an update to Finale 3.2 for Mac? I thought I saw a posting
about a 3.2.1. If this is true, can it be obtained on-line?

I would appreciate any answers to these questions.

-- David Carson Berry

======================================================================
= David Carson Berry | "Shut up, he explained." =
= University of North Texas | -- Ring Lardner =
= Denton, TX USA | (anticipating the tone of =
= Internet: dcb0001@jove.acs.unt.edu | rebuttals instantly trans- =
= CompuServe: 74063,1213 | mitted via the Internet) =
======================================================================

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 15:23:22 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 95 16:20:33 +0000
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Finale under OS/2
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit

Would you please add me to the Finale mailing list? I'm particularly
interested in information on running Finale under OS/2.

Thank you.

Hugh Brock
The Harp Column -- "Practical News For Practical Harpists"
Ann Arbor, MI

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 17:30:16 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 95 23:09:28 GMT
From: Patsy Moore <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Incipits

In message <Pine.[email protected]>
Charles Nagel writes:

> Has anyone figured out a reasonably effective way do do incipits?

I don't do actual incipits, but have so far taken the cowards' way out
to insert original clefs and voice ranges at the beginning of my
scores. I simply indent the first system about 1 1/2 inches to allow
room to draw a short section of stave in by hand afterwards and insert
them. Having seen the other responses to this question I'm even more
daunted than I was before at the idea of trying to cope with this in
Finale. Am I being unnecessarily faint-hearted?

--
Patsy Moore ([email protected])
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 17:41:20 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 15:38:29 PST
Subject: Printing Problems

I'm going nuts. Finale is refusing to print my documents. I'm running 3.2
on a Powerbook 165 and print on a Stylewriter II. I've given it over two
megs of RAM. It takes forever to scan the document, and then simply quits
or freezes. Also, I've noticed that my redraw is incredibly slow. Does
anyone know what I can do? I've checked my printer with some other
programs and it works fine.

Will Stewart
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 18:18:29 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 17:19:09 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Incipits
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Fri, 27 Jan 1995, Patsy Moore wrote:

> I don't do actual incipits, but have so far taken the cowards' way out
> to insert original clefs and voice ranges at the beginning of my
> scores. I simply indent the first system about 1 1/2 inches to allow
> room to draw a short section of stave in by hand afterwards and insert
> them. Having seen the other responses to this question I'm even more
> daunted than I was before at the idea of trying to cope with this in
> Finale. Am I being unnecessarily faint-hearted?

I think so. If you had trouble following my instructions, write to me and
I'll binhex you a copy of a template set up for incipits. Let me know
what version and platform you are using. (Yes it will have my default
settings in it [for those in on that thread - I wouldn't send it to a
publisher but to one of you who freely share info with me it's only fair])
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 18:25:15 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 17:25:54 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Rameau font
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Fri, 27 Jan 1995, David Carson Berry wrote:

> (1) Where may one obtain the figured-bass font "Rameau 20" (or whatever it
> is called)? For those that use it, what symbols are allowed -- that is,
> I'm sure it can vertically stack "6-4-2" but what about the various ways
> of indicating raised or lowered intervals, etc.

Rameau was created by Coda and is probably only available through them.
It does have quite a few symbols but not all and certainly not all of the
raised and lowered intervals. It has the struck through numbers and
symbols for major and minor chords in the "Nashville Number" system (if
you know or use that). Anything which it doesn't have can quite easily be
manufactured in the chord tool or the shape designer.
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 18:33:00 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 17:33:44 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Midi playback
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

> >> How do you "optimize out" non-empty staves (i.e., those staves containing the
> >> realization of the ornaments)? It has been my experience that optimization
> will
> >> remove only staves containing no entries.
>
> >Optimize *before* entering the trill playback notes. At that point the
> >staves are empty. Optimizing freezes the page view.
>
> If you do this, you will have to have your layout completely finalized before
> entering these notes; if you have to adjust the layout, you will have problems
> with the formerly optimized staves, and you won't be able to hide the playback
> staves unless you delete out the "invisible" notes.

Blake
Optimizing freezes the pagelayout but gives you handles on each
staff in page view for fine tuning the systems. The handles are accessed
in the Staff Attributes tool. So page layout does not have to be
finalized. If you are composing as you go along I would recommend
creating a template with the page view approximated (for more than enough
pages). One could enter a quarter rest in each measure of the score
staves, copy it to the entire range, optimize, then erase the rests to
create the template. Are we getting closer?
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 19:08:45 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 20:10:14 -0500
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Gil Plantinga)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Rameau font

>On Fri, 27 Jan 1995, David Carson Berry wrote:
>
>> (1) Where may one obtain the figured-bass font "Rameau 20" (or whatever it
>> is called)? For those that use it, what symbols are allowed -- that is,
>> I'm sure it can vertically stack "6-4-2" but what about the various ways
>> of indicating raised or lowered intervals, etc.
>
>

Larry Worster wrote:

>Rameau was created by Coda and is probably only available through them.
>It does have quite a few symbols but not all and certainly not all of the
>raised and lowered intervals. It has the struck through numbers and
>symbols for major and minor chords in the "Nashville Number" system (if
>you know or use that). Anything which it doesn't have can quite easily be
>manufactured in the chord tool or the shape designer.
>

One caveat -- Rameau (and its jazz/percussion companion) are/were type 3 fonts.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Gil Plantinga
New Paltz, NY
(914) 255-2775
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 23:34:15 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 1995 23:30:46 -0600 (CST)
From: Brian J Campbell <brianjc@jove.acs.unt.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Inexpensive Finale
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950127232908.14148F-100000@jove.acs.unt.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Fri, 27 Jan 1995, Peter Temko wrote:
> A while back among the least expensive places to get Finale was at the
> University of Northern Colorado bookstore - they even had a mail order
> catalog, I think. I've lost the address and all the catalogs.
> Does anyone know if they are still mail-ordering, if they are still cheap
> - and if so, does anyone have the 800 number?
As far as I know (and I'm now working for a store that retails Finale at
educational prices) $275 is the going price. I have never seen it
anywhere else lower, and I don't know that Coda will allow it to be sold
for any less.

Brian Campbell
/----------------\
|-----------------------------------|----------------------------------------|
|STUCK at UNT Department of Music |INTERNET: brianjc@jove.acs.unt.edu |
|in lovely Denton, Texas, USA |Snail:526 Alegre Vista;Denton, TX 76205 |
|Jazz/Arranging/Comp/Saxophone/Winds|Voice: (817) 382-7131 |
|-----------(It's not a town, just an Incredible Simulation)-----------------|
\__________________________________________________________________/

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 08:15:31 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 07:16:15 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Inexpensive Finale
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Fri, 27 Jan 1995, Brian J Campbell wrote:
> As far as I know (and I'm now working for a store that retails Finale at
> educational prices) $275 is the going price. I have never seen it
> anywhere else lower, and I don't know that Coda will allow it to be sold
> for any less.

Two sources that I know of sell it for less.

Software Plus Academic Inc: 800-377-9943 ($250)
University of Colorado Boulder: 303-492-3431 ($229) [I don't know if they
will ship it)
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 09:04:37 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 08:05:22 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Help!
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Fri, 27 Jan 1995, Mahler wrote:

> Please help me! Can someone please send me a detailed explanation of how to set
> a different sound to each staff, so I can hear my work on something other than
> the piano setting? I own a MacIntosh Color Classic and a Yamaha PSR-510
> Multi-Timbral Keyboard. I just can't seem to get any other sound than the
> number 1 piano setting. Thanks in advance.

See Midi Channels in Volume II of the manual. If you are doing all that
and it still doesn't work see the manual for the keyboard. I've never had
any problems with it although I'm not an expert by far.

Larry Worster
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 09:42:54 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 08:37:50 MST
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: Printing Problems

Which system are you using? Finale doesn't work with the new Printer
Driver GX (System 7.5).

-- Ofer
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 09:50:50 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 09:51:24 -0600 (CST)
From: Barry Ursaki <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Windows Finale to Mac Finale file compatibility...
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Fri. 27 Jan 1995, Jim Laurendeau wrote:
>
> On Thu, 26 Jan 1995, Jay Brian Kummer wrote:
>
> > Hi:
> >
> > What would be the best way to import a WinFinale 3.0 file into the
> > current version of MacFinale (if possible)? A few tests reveal that there
> > are some problems doing this.
> >
> > Thanks.
>
>
>
> When saving the file choose file type "Enigma Transportable File", then
> make sure this is selected when opening the file on the other computer.
> (This is provided that you save the file in some way that is readable by
> both computers)
>

I have tried this using WinFinale 3.0 going to a version of MacFinale that
a prof. of mine has. As soon as he put the disk in, his Mac wanted to
format it, refusing to read it. He tried accessing it through MacLink. It
told him to *please wait* while it loaded the file. An hour and a half
later, it was still telling him to *please wait*. He gave up.

Also, WinFin 3.0 tells me I have to have a Postscript printer selected as
my default before it will compile an EPS file. I can do this, but, it's a
pain.

Any suggestions?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Barry Ursaki |-_ + Good musicians execute their music. |
| Saskatoon, SK | -_ + |
| Canada. /\| | + Bad ones murder it! |
| \/ | + |
| <[email protected]> | + |
| or /\| + Hug a Musician... |
| <[email protected]> \/ + they never get to dance. |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 10:21:06 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 10:21:38 -0600 (CST)
From: Barry Ursaki <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
CC: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale for Windows 3.0.1 updater
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII



On Thu, 26 Jan 1995, Andrew Zinck wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>, Meredith wrote:
> > I downloaded the Windows 3.0.1 updater from AOL and posted it to
> > alt.binaries.sounds.utilities. It's over 1.2Mb uuencoded so I won't send it
> > to the list. I'll try uploading it to a ftp site if someone would suggest
> > a good one.

After reading this on the 26th, I went into alt.binaries.sounds.utilities.
All I found was file (3/3) of the update and it was only 44kb according to
what Tin told me when it uudecoded the file.

Where's the rest of it?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Barry Ursaki |-_ + Good musicians execute their music. |
| Saskatoon, SK | -_ + |
| Canada. /\| | + Bad ones murder it! |
| \/ | + |
| <[email protected]> | + |
| or /\| + Hug a Musician... |
| <[email protected]> \/ + they never get to dance. |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 13:06:34 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 95 13:08 CST
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Thomas Schaller)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Lyrics and how to beat them

Lyrics! Why not start another can of worms (although it seems the guys
using Score envy us for what we have). I think we all learned how to use
the Lyric tools and what to avoid - but one thing seems to be harder to
play with than Wall Street: Word extensions. No matter if you postscript
preview or use different View percentages - those little, thin lines never
line up if you have more than one verse.

So here's my suggestion of the day: If you have melismas with more than one
verse create invisible characters on all the verses under the last note of
the melisma. Then drag your word extensions also from these invisible
characters to the left until they overlap the normal lines coming from your
text syllables. By that you'll get a nice sharp alignment at the end of
your melismas.

>><<>><<>><<>><<
Thomas Schaller
(312) 922-3616
Chicago, IL 60605
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 13:09:10 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 10:59:33 -0800 (PST)
From: Alan Chapman <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Rameau font
To: [email protected], [email protected]
CC: [email protected]
Message-ID: <Pine.3.87.9501281033.A25621-0100000@cougar>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

An opinion on Rameau from someone who uses Finale to generate a
considerable number of music theory assignments and handouts:

The most efficient way to add Roman numerals and figured bass is to treat
them as lyrics! (Actually I use Palatino for this.)

Let the Roman numerals be "Verse 1" in whatever point size you like. Let
each "level" of the figures (i.e., the "6" and the "4" of a six-four chord)
be an additional verse. Use the various positioning adjustments to make
things come out right.

As I see it, the problem with Rameau is that its creators offer a limited
set of Roman numeral and figured bass combinations (such as "V7.")

I do find Rameau useful for accidentals in figured bass. I add those as note
expressions and position them next to the appropriate "lyric" figures.

Alan Chapman

P.S. A picture is worth a thousand words. If anyone would like to see a
sample of what I've described above, send your address.

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 13:16:36 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 13:17:08 -0600
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Brent Hugh)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale for Windows 3.0.1 updater

>> In article <[email protected]>, Meredith wrote:
>> > I downloaded the Windows 3.0.1 updater from AOL and posted it to
>> > alt.binaries.sounds.utilities. It's over 1.2Mb uuencoded so I won't
send it
>> > to the list. I'll try uploading it to a ftp site if someone would suggest
>> > a good one.
>
>After reading this on the 26th, I went into alt.binaries.sounds.utilities.
>All I found was file (3/3) of the update and it was only 44kb according to
>what Tin told me when it uudecoded the file.
>
>Where's the rest of it?

I noticed the same thing here. I suspect that somewhere along the chain of
newslinks, some server decided to strip out "overly large" files. So files
1 and 2 (which were probably quite large) were never passed along.

I suppose its time to resort to the ftp sites.

BTW, if some ambitious soul wants to upload it for immediate availability,
wuarchive.wustl.edu is a good choice. You can create your own directory
there (or use a pre-existing one) and just upload it; it doesn't have to go
through a big approval process. Files are automatically deleted after a
certain amount of time, however.

--Brent
[email protected]

Music Instruction Software Page:
http://www.cstp.umkc.edu/users/bhugh/musici.html

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 13:21:56 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 95 12:22:37 MST
From: jmitch@cybele.math.unm.edu (John Mitchell)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <9501281922.AA17778@cybele.math.unm.edu>
To: [email protected] (Finale)
Subject: Re: Inexpensive Finale

>A while back among the least expensive places to get Finale was at the
>University of Northern Colorado bookstore - they even had a mail order
>catalog, I think. I've lost the address and all the catalogs.
>
>Does anyone know if they are still mail-ordering, if they are still cheap
>- and if so, does anyone have the 800 number?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Pete Temko
>Prof. of Music
>University of Tennessee at Chattanooga
>([email protected])
>**************************************

MacBeat in Santa Fe was selling it for $250 as of a month or so ago.

1-800-MACBEAT

BTW, I just heard that at the recent NAMM show MacBeat was named the #1 music software dealer in the.

Jack Mitchell

*******************
John J. Mitchell

[email protected]
*******************

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 13:44:30 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a Copyist

Hi all. I thought I would share with the group some comments a friend of
mine made on a posting to this thread that I had forwarded him. Food for
thought...

>Would the following offend the engravers?
>
>I gather that the minutia mentioned in the post is of such detail that it
>doesn't really matter. For instance, adherence to all the referenced details
>probably doesn't make it any easier for the musician to read at a glance so
>it probably doesn't enhance the performance quality.
>
>Remember in previous centuries when the first letter of a book or chapter (or
>the initial page of medieval music manuscript) had incredible artwork in the
>form of colorful embellishment? That printed page was an art form in itself,
>a visual art. It didn't make the music sound any better but it certainly was
>detailed. And it was visual art.
>
>It seems to me this level of music engravers' minutia is somewhere in between
>the two. It requires a huge amount of detail that probably only the
>professional will take the time with. But it is not really what we would
>call a visual art. It doesn't move the emotions of anyone other than the
>professional engraver. So why bother?
>
>My thoughts, for what they are worth.
>
>Mike
>

=======================================================
Dan Galbraith <> [email protected] <> (913) 599-5456 <> Overland Park, KS
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
"Through the modem, off the gateway, around the router... nothing but net!"
=======================================================

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 14:12:00 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 13:12:44 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Windows Finale to Mac Finale file compatibility...
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

From Barry Ursaki

> I have tried this using WinFinale 3.0 going to a version of MacFinale that
> a prof. of mine has. As soon as he put the disk in, his Mac wanted to
> format it, refusing to read it.

Of course, it's an IBM disk. Look for a utility called Apple File
Exchange. It comes with the system software (the newer versions of the
Mac system have PC Exchange loaded in). You must start up Apple File
Exchange before inserting the disk. It then appears in one section of the
window and you hard disk appears in the other. Copy. That's it. It's
easy. I don't know what MacLink did to you but this method always works.
Larry Worster
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 14:24:26 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 15:25:10 -0500
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (David Froom)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Value of a Copyist

>>I gather that the minutia mentioned in the post is of such detail that it
>>doesn't really matter. For instance, adherence to all the referenced details
>>probably doesn't make it any easier for the musician to read at a glance so
>>it probably doesn't enhance the performance quality.

As a composer who is married to a performer, I can tell you that I see over
and over again how a beautifully engraved score IS easier to read, more
pleasurable to work on, and has a better shot at a good performance if only
because ALL of the performer's work goes into the playing (none into
deciphering).

>>But it is not really what we would
>>call a visual art. It doesn't move the emotions of anyone other than the
>>professional engraver. So why bother?

I have certainly had the level of emotional involvement with a work
enhanced by the look of it (and I am not a professional engraver). These
emotions are enhanced sometimes by looking at a manuscript or facsimile,
sometimes by looking at ancient engraving, sometimes by looking at a
spectacular new edition. Presentation has never made bad music good -- but
it certainly enhances the effect of good music (for everyone except the
person who listens without ever having seen the score; and even this
person may benefit from the performer's enhanced experience).

The counter argument is like saying that the taste of a great meal is not
enhanced by the presentation, so why not just eat it out of the pan over
the sink? Or why bother carefully to engrave and bind a book, when the
words can be presented cleary in a stack of stapled typewritten sheets?

If you want your best chance for a fine-china-and-sterling-silver-on-
linen-tablecloth performance, you will want to provide the performers with
a fine-china-and-sterling-silver-on-linen-tablecloth score. You can, if
you wish, serve it up on paper plates with plastic utensils, but it somehow
just won't be the same.

David Froom - [email protected]
Music Department
St. Mary's College of Maryland
St. Mary's City, Maryland

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 14:44:17 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 13:49:17 -0500 (EST)
From: Lieutenant (jg) Gig Line <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: Printing Problems

I have FinWin 3.0 and a Canon BJ230 bubblejet printer.
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 15:38:50 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 15:35:26 -0600 (CST)
From: Kelly Jon Rossum <kjr0001@jove.acs.unt.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale Discussion <[email protected]>
Subject: Finale MIDI: OS/2
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950128152803.2317B-100000@jove.acs.unt.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Finale will not recognize my MIDI input while using the speedy note entry
through the synth. "MIDI device is already in use" is the error message
that comes up. I've shut off every sound in the OS/2 shell and tried to
trace the problem to another application, but everything is off. I'm
using a Media Vision soundcard with a MIDI adaptor running out of the
Joystick/MIDI port. The internal jumper on the card is set to enable the
hookup. Everything should work...

Help?? TIA.
Kelly Rossum
kjr0001@jove.acs.unt.edu
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 17:37:50 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 16:38:33 -0700 (MST)
From: george l fosterll <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: REPEATEDLY BEING UNSUBSCRIBED
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Alright guys, this is the 3rd time since subscibing to this list that I
have been bounced. What's the problem? First time I was bounced I asked
what was going on and got a nice explanatory message from one of the list
admin people and an apology. Hot on it's tail, the next day I got a really
smart-assed reply from what was apparently some network-admin nerd
at SHSU implying that all my problems were of my own making and if I
didn't like the fact that I was accidently unsubscibed the I could shove
it. I politely ignored his ramblings which for the most part were totally
irrelevant. Second time was in December when apparently many people were
dropped. Once again I dutifully resubcribed, this time putting my
curiosity in check as I didn't want to hear from the apparently demented
nerd that wrote me last time. Now for the third time (second in as many
months) I will resubscribe. I hope all this is due to some funky
hard/software glitch and not due to the malicious intentions of some
misguided person at SHSU.

With all that said, I want whoever reads this to know that I really find
the Finale list quite helpful and informative. To those who keep it
working, my blessings, best wishs and appreciation. To those others who
may or may not be interfering with its operation, my opinions are best
left unexpressed.

Thanks

GF



================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 17:40:10 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 17:40:41 -0600
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Brent Hugh)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Help!

>Please help me! Can someone please send me a detailed explanation of how
to set
>a different sound to each staff, so I can hear my work on something other than
>the piano setting? I own a MacIntosh Color Classic and a Yamaha PSR-510
>Multi-Timbral Keyboard. I just can't seem to get any other sound than the
>number 1 piano setting. Thanks in advance.

Besides the other things you have to do within Finale, make sure your
synthesizer is set to Mode 99-Multi. There should be a button on your
synthesizer somewhere that switches between Mode 00-Remote and Mode 99-Multi
(the terminology might be a bit different on your synth).

Even if Finale is set up properly, if you are in Mode 00-Remote, you still
will get incorrect output. The most likely thing that will happen is that
everything will just play out on the default piano sound.

The reason for this is that when you are in Mode 00-Remote, the synth
funnels all 16 channels (as sent by Finale) right down into channel 1.

Now suppose you have four staves which you are trying to play out with four
different voices. So in "Window/Instrument List" you have set up the
instruments as follows:

Instrument Channel Patch Staff Name
------------ ------- ----- ----------
Instrument 1 1 43 Staff 1
Instrument 2 2 92 Staff 2
Instrument 3 3 31 Staff 3
Instrument 4 4 75 Staff 4

Although you haven't specified patches for the other channels, by default
they are set to the lowest patch number (0 or 1 depending on whether you are
set up for 0- or 1-based patches).

So when you press the "play" button to hear your masterpiece, Finale merrily
sends out the patches for each channel in order, i.e.:

Channel 1 43
Channel 2 92
Channel 3 31
Channel 4 75
Channel 5 0
Channel 6 0
. 0
. 0
. 0
Channel 16 0

Now don't forget that your synth, in Mode 00-Remote, is redirecting all
Channels to Channel 1. So Channel 1 is set to patch 43, then instantly to
patch 92, then patch 31, patch 75, and then repeatedly to patch 0. After
all this is done, Channel 1 is left on patch 0 (the last patch sent is the
winner).

After this, your masterpiece begins to play, all on channel 1, and so all
with patch 0.

As I mentioned, the simple solution to this is to set your Synth in Mode
99-Multi. Depending on your particular synth, you will most likely have to
manually set it in this mode everytime you turn the synth off and on.

Sorry for the long-winded reply to a trivial problem, but I'm in a
long-winded mood today :)

--Brent
[email protected]

------------------------------------------------
Music Instruction Software Page:
http://www.cstp.umkc.edu/users/bhugh/musici.html
------------------------------------------------

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 19:04:53 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 20:05:35 -0500
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Michael O'Connor)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale for Windows 3.0.1 updater

>On Thu, 26 Jan 1995, Andrew Zinck wrote:
>
>> In article <[email protected]>, Meredith wrote:
>> > I downloaded the Windows 3.0.1 updater from AOL and posted it to
>> > alt.binaries.sounds.utilities. It's over 1.2Mb uuencoded so I won't
send it
>> > to the list. I'll try uploading it to a ftp site if someone would suggest
>> > a good one.

This was a good thought but my news server--which has a lot of
newsgroups--doesn't have an alt.binaries.sounds.utilities group.
It would be great to have access to the file at an ftp site.

Mike O
*****************************
Michael O'Connor
[email protected]
Florida State University
*****************************

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 22:26:01 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (John R. Girouard)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: Subscibe
To: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 1995 23:26:42 -0500 (EST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

SUBSCRIBE Finale

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 17:53:21 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab52b94b03021004f8d6@[158.135.73.248]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 17:49:31 -0600
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Henry Howey)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: REPEATEDLY BEING UNSUBSCRIBED

>With all that said, I want whoever reads this to know that I really find
>the Finale list quite helpful and informative. To those who keep it
>working, my blessings, best wishs and appreciation. To those others who
>may or may not be interfering with its operation, my opinions are best
>left unexpressed.

As I understand the situation, the ListServ's removal of patrons is a
response to an "echo" which causes messages to rebound around the net. The
exact cause is variable, and the ListServ has no choice but to break
communication when the problem recurs. As upsetting as this is, there is
presently no recourse but to re-up when the problems occur. SHSU is a
major hub on the net which alone may cause some of the problems. All of us
have problems which require re-booting on our individual machines; the
problem with the ListServ should be viewed as a net equivalent of this sort
of frustration.

Please keep a copy of the ListServ commands handy if the net activity still
is a problem.

To subscribe to the FINALE list, send an e-mail message to
[email protected] consisting of SUBSCRIBE Finale. The following message
will be sent to you.

Further administrative requests regarding this list should be sent to:
[email protected]
The following commands can be handled automatically by the list processor:
SIGNOFF Finale - to remove yourself from the list
REVIEW Finale - to get a list of subscribers
QUERY Finale - to get the status of your entry on the list
SET Finale MAIL - to resume receiving mail from the list
SET Finale NOMAIL - to remain on the list but not receive mail
SET Finale CONCEAL - to not report your address in a REVIEW
SET Finale NOCONCEAL - to report your address in a REVIEW SET Finale REPRO
- to receive posts you make to Finale
SET Finale NOREPRO - to not receive posts you make to Finale
LIST - to get a list of mailing lists served by
this host
HELP - to receive a help file

By default, subscriptions are set to MAIL, REPRO, NOCONCEAL.

THE DIGEST
To receive the digest version (generated at approximately 6 a.m. each
morning from the prior 24 hours worth of posts and distributed at that
time), you need to (a) subscribe to Finale-Digest and (b) unsubscribe from
Finale (unfortunately, we do not yet support a SET DIGEST option, so a
companion list is required). To achieve this, include the following two
lines of text:
SIGNOFF Finale
SUBSCRIBE Finale-Digest "Your Real Name in Quotes"
in the body of a mail message to [email protected].



Henry Howey
Professor
Department of Music
Sam Houston State University
Huntsville, TX 77341
[email protected]
FAX (409) 294-3765
W (409) 294-1364
H (409) 291-0626
Owner of FINALE Discussion List





================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 18:35:44 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 1995 20:20:28 -0800 (PST)
From: Charles Nagel <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: finale <[email protected]>
Subject: MAC upgrades & bugs
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I've noticed that there have been a number of questions posted to this
list regarding assorted bugs with printing and other functions of Finale
and Mac; and that an apparently significant number of these indicate that
the users have upgraded to MAC system 7.5. I'm wondering if it's not such
a good idea to"upgrade" my Mac's system 7.1. The Fin.3.2.1 upgrade is
slouching toward my computer via snail mail; would that make a difference?
(peripheral comment: if anyone is wondering about the effect of last
night's earthquake in Seattle, it screwed up the phone system for a few
hours, but as far as I can tell the U. of W.'s computer system, etc.,
survived; had to spend a few minutes striaghtening the paintings on the
walls.)
thanks
charlie nagel
P.O.Box 535
vashon island, WA 98070
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 18:36:26 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 11:39:43 -0600 (CST)
From: michael eckert <meckert@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
CC: [email protected]
Subject: Re: #s in Staff expression Tool
Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.91.950130113603.211252A-100000@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I had the same problem yesterday evening with the shift-3 (normal sized)
sharp. The smaller sharp (shift or something else plus the "I" key, I
don't recall) is OK. But I think you've definitely uncovered a bug. Sorry
I can't offer a solution.
To the folks who answered my questions last week, thanks; I still had
problems with lyric placement when I copied 2 pages of one version of a
document into 2 pages of another version with different staff settings.
I'll try optimizing all staves and see what happens.

Michael Eckert

On Fri, 27 Jan 1995, Lindsay Vickery wrote:

> Lindsay Vickery: FinMac 3.2 and 3.0.1
> Is anyone else having trouble with #s turning into 0s in the staff
> expression tool. A friend brough it to my attention when he was writing
> some chord symbols. And now I have it too!! He described a system of
> writing a 1 at the beginning of the offending expression which made the 0
> back into a #. But then he had to liquid paper the 1 out on the hard
> copy. I tried this AND making the # up in petrucci and then attaching it
> in the middle of the helvetica expression and neither work!!
> Any ideas? Al also think I might have been unsubscribed as I've had no
> mail for a while. I just subscribed again....I hope.
> Thanks Folks
> LV [email protected]
>
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 18:36:28 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 11:39:43 -0600 (CST)
From: michael eckert <meckert@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected], [email protected]
CC: [email protected]
Subject: Re: #s in Staff expression Tool
Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.91.950130113603.211252A-100000@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I had the same problem yesterday evening with the shift-3 (normal sized)
sharp. The smaller sharp (shift or something else plus the "I" key, I
don't recall) is OK. But I think you've definitely uncovered a bug. Sorry
I can't offer a solution.
To the folks who answered my questions last week, thanks; I still had
problems with lyric placement when I copied 2 pages of one version of a
document into 2 pages of another version with different staff settings.
I'll try optimizing all staves and see what happens.

Michael Eckert

On Fri, 27 Jan 1995, Lindsay Vickery wrote:

> Lindsay Vickery: FinMac 3.2 and 3.0.1
> Is anyone else having trouble with #s turning into 0s in the staff
> expression tool. A friend brough it to my attention when he was writing
> some chord symbols. And now I have it too!! He described a system of
> writing a 1 at the beginning of the offending expression which made the 0
> back into a #. But then he had to liquid paper the 1 out on the hard
> copy. I tried this AND making the # up in petrucci and then attaching it
> in the middle of the helvetica expression and neither work!!
> Any ideas? Al also think I might have been unsubscribed as I've had no
> mail for a while. I just subscribed again....I hope.
> Thanks Folks
> LV [email protected]
>
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 18:56:45 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <v01510100ab50ed2b29bf@[199.212.154.44]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 1995 02:24:45 -0500
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (marc sabat)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Fonts for Microtonal Work

Query to MacFinale experts who have experience with font modification...

What software do you recommend for modifying Petrucci to include more
microtonal symbols. I'm not happy with the quarter-tone symbols provided.
Are there any modified fonts already out there?

---thanks for the help, marc.

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 19:06:07 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 17:19:10 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale group <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

QUERY Finale
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 19:28:31 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 20:08:42 +0000
To: [email protected], kjr0001@jove.acs.unt.edu
From: Stephen Ferre <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale MIDI: OS/2
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

You may, I'm afraid, be stuck. Doesn't the yellow READ ME sheet in your
box to version 3.0 specifically state "Finale is not designed for use with
OS/2. I vaguely recall reading this. I can't check because I use Mac
Finale at home and PC Finale at work.

>Finale will not recognize my MIDI input while using the speedy note entry
>through the synth. "MIDI device is already in use" is the error message
>that comes up. I've shut off every sound in the OS/2 shell and tried to
>trace the problem to another application, but everything is off. I'm
>using a Media Vision soundcard with a MIDI adaptor running out of the
>Joystick/MIDI port. The internal jumper on the card is set to enable the
>hookup. Everything should work...
>
>Help?? TIA.
>Kelly Rossum
>kjr0001@jove.acs.unt.edu

[email protected][Stephen Ferre]
New Notations, London

Any opinions expressed above are mine, not necessarily those of New
Notations.

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 19:32:33 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 20:08:53 +0000
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: Stephen Ferre <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: RE: Printing Problems
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

>I have FinWin 3.0 and a Canon BJ230 bubblejet printer.

I have a client who uses a Canon BJ600 who is having problems, too. Have
you contacted Canon for an updated driver.

At any rate, I would be interested if you get any solutions.

Steve

[email protected][Stephen Ferre]
New Notations, London

Any opinions expressed above are mine, not necessarily those of New
Notations.

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 19:55:30 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 20:08:16 +0000
To: [email protected]
From: Stephen Ferre <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Who owns data file?/Ties
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Blake Hodgetts writes:

>Well, that is going a bit far. I don't know which platform you are using, but
>on
>the Mac I have devised ties settings that work quite well for most musical
>situations. I would never call them "thoroughly and completely inadequate".
>There is one point, however, that I wish Coda could do something about (Eric?
>Tech Support? Development, are you listening?): the tie settings I use cause
>the
>ties to collide with the dot on dotted notes when those notes fall on a line
>(rather than on a space). They look perfect otherwise, but I have to manually
>adjust ties that follow dotted line-notes, a great pain in the rear
>(especially
>in compound meters!). It would be nice if there were a configurable option for
>"ties after dots" which took into account whether the notes are on lines or on
>spaces. I have also noticed that ties on whole notes are placed too close to
>the
>notehead; Finale needs to be aware of the different sizes of noteheads (this
>should be configurable as well). Basically, there should be a whole dialog
>box's
>worth of settings for Ties, not just a couple of fields.

Wouldn't it be nice if the tie defaults were treated like the slur
placement in the new smartshapes menu in Mac v.3.2 with defaults for
several situations which can be set either graphically or numerically.

Steve

[email protected][Stephen Ferre]
New Notations, London

Any opinions expressed above are mine, not necessarily those of New
Notations.

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 19:56:44 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 1995 16:24:48 -0800
From: [email protected] (Harold Owen)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Trills for playback
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <v01510100ab51d6ac089a@DialupEudora>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

I have tried creating a staff for trills and other embellishments,
optimizing it out, then entering the embellishments in scroll view and
setting the original notes to 0 velocity, and it works fine. I have
discovered another neat way to do it, though.

Move the visual music to Layer 2 (or 2 and 3 if there are two layers).
Enter the embellishments manually in Layer 1, then use Alternate Notation
to hide them. Alternate notation works only on Layer 1. You can change
the velocities of the original notes to zero using the MIDI tool
(double-click the measure, select the notes you don't want to hear, and
change their velocities to 0). This worked very well for a keyboard piece
by Bach I wanted to "ornament" - my students saw the original and heard my
ornaments. It would be very useful also for continuo parts with hidden
realization that is heard when the fil is played back.

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 19:59:33 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 1995 03:11:21 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: UNSUBSCRIBE

Please unsubscribe me from this mailing list... Interesting, but I have to
wade through too much to get something I need... also, TOO many non-delivery
messages flying all over the place!

THanks

Paul SImmons
Sacramento
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 20:06:14 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 18:42:59 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale group <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

QUERY Finale

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 20:07:16 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Lyrics and how to beat them

>Lyrics! Why not start another can of worms (although it seems the guys
>using Score envy us for what we have). I think we all learned how to use
>the Lyric tools and what to avoid - but one thing seems to be harder to
>play with than Wall Street: Word extensions. No matter if you postscript
>preview or use different View percentages - those little, thin lines never
>line up if you have more than one verse.
>
>So here's my suggestion of the day: If you have melismas with more than one
>verse create invisible characters on all the verses under the last note of
>the melisma. Then drag your word extensions also from these invisible
>characters to the left until they overlap the normal lines coming from your
>text syllables. By that you'll get a nice sharp alignment at the end of
>your melismas.

It might be added that the "straight line" smart shape makes a good word
extension when drawn while holding down <shift>.

=======================================================
Dan Galbraith <> [email protected] <> (913) 599-5456 <> Overland Park, KS
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
"Through the modem, off the gateway, around the router... nothing but net!"
=======================================================

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 20:40:16 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 1995 12:14:45 -0800
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Kevin Moore)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: RE: Lyrics and how to beat them

In case Coda is listening, all you have to do in Mosaic to get a word
extension is type "_" after the word-it always lines up perfectly

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 20:50:06 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Mike Ossmann <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 95 20:47:58 -0900
To: [email protected]
Subject: FinMac 3.2.1 summary?

Apparently something was wrong with the digests last week. Most of
the digests included many more postings in the table of contents than
in the actual body.

This is no big deal except that I missed the discussion on the 3.2.1
upgrade. Would somebody post a brief summary?

Thanks in advance.
---
Mike Ossmann
[email protected]
*Equal rights for children!*
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 20:50:40 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Mike Ossmann <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 95 20:54:38 -0900
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: incomplete digests

I'm still receiving Finale-digests with less postings than are listed
in the table of contents.

---
Mike Ossmann
[email protected]
*Equal rights for children!*
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 21:01:06 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 1995 12:36:41 +0200
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (just another VKTM)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: List down?

Is the list down? Can someone write me direct if this
gets posted?

John Binkov

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 21:02:09 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 1995 09:47:32 +0200
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (just another VKTM)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: SUBSCRIBE Finale

SUBSCRIBE Finale [email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 21:11:59 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Robert Patterson <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Burt Fenner <[email protected]>, Finale News Group <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: Wedges
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 95 09:41:00 CST
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Burt Fenner wrote:

<<Correct me if I am wrong, but I have always thought that wedges were
avoided
because, when printing engraved music, if they were not sufficiently large
they were subject to being filled in with ink. >>

Absolutely correct.

<<Since that is no longer a problem, must we worry?>>

Well, of course *must* is a very strong word. I don't think anyone MUST
worry, but nonetheless some of us DO. (And I'll be the first to admit that
those who do, self included, probably have a compulsive streak.) I think
because the common practice for so long has been to avoid wedges, wedgeless
engraving has a more polished look. The old chicken-and-egg. Ross, who was
writing long before the advent of the personal composer, addressed this in
his book. According to Ross, printing technology already in 1970 was capable
of not filling in the wedges. In fact, Ross implied that wedge-avoidance
originated hundreds of years before and that printing technology had long
since advanced beyond the need to avoid wedges, if the only concern was that
they would fill in. (I can give you a citation, but my copy is not in front
of me. It is in the section where he describes wedges.)

As is the case with music notation in general, music typesetting standards
seem to have evolved from a whole host of needs--both practical and
aesthetic. Ultimately, the extent to which a Finale user follows them is a
personal choice: the same choice that pen-and-ink composers made just a few
years ago. How meticulous am I going to be? Not every pen-and-ink composer
put out scores that looked like George Crumb's, although presumably anyone
with patience and effort could have. With Crumb, I believe that the creation
of a visual artwork is inextricably bound with the creation of an aural
artwork. Once, in a discussion of Bach's music, he referred to every "page"
of Bach's music. Indeed, in every conversation I've ever had with him, he
always discusses music in terms of pages: not time, not movements, not
measures, but pages. I've been told that when he composes a new piece, the
first thing he decides is how many pages it will be. Then he lays all the
blank pages out on hangers all around his walls and gradually begins to fill
them all in all at once.

Everyone is different. For me, the process of engraving the music is part of
the process of composing it. Part of my motivation is that I believe that my
music is good (else why write it), and if it is good, it deserves the same
presentation that any Beethoven symphony has. I view the notation as a
window into the music, and the higher-quality the notation is, the less
grime there is on the window. Given the fierce competition for performances,
I want MY windows to be squeaky clean!

I hope you read David Froom's posting on this subject as well, because I
think he expressed similar views from a different perspective that was quite
useful.

Robert
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 21:13:28 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 1995 13:54:03 -0800
Message-ID: <199501292154.NAA19536@desiree.teleport.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (John Philip Dimick)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Test--please ignore

test

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 21:20:15 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 14:32:47 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: How unsubscribe this list?

I've lost the original file that included how to unsubscribe this list.
Until I get my AOL software problems fixed, I need to do this. Will someone
please let me know how? Thanks.

--Tyler Tex
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 21:30:21 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 19:30:59 -0800
Message-ID: <199501310330.TAA05846@desiree.teleport.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (John Philip Dimick)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Print exports to WinWord w/ inkjet--no way?

I'd like to export WinFin output to WinWord 6.0a docs. Problem is, I have an
inkjet printer (Epson Stylus Color, 720 dpi), which, as far as I know, isn't
capable of printing EPS exports.

So what I'm asking is this: Does anyone have a good idea on how to include
an inkjet-printable line of music from WinFin in a WinWord doc? The best
I've been able to manage so far is a "printscreen" transfer via the
clipboard, but it's rather jagged. I am hoping that since Petrucci is a
TrueType font, there might be some way to bring it across accurately. TIA.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
John Philip Dimick
[email protected]
The Flamenco Guitar Home Page
http://www.teleport.com/~jdimick/fg.html

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 21:33:30 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: List down?

>Is the list down? Can someone write me direct if this
>gets posted?
>
>John Binkov

the list works fine for me. Try sending "review finale" to
"[email protected]" to see if you are on the list. If not, re-subscribe by
sending "subscribe finale" to "[email protected]"

=======================================================
Dan Galbraith <> <> [email protected] <> <> Overland Park, KS
<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>
"Through the modem, off the gateway, around the router... nothing but net!"
=======================================================

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 21:53:44 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 95 19:57:07 -0800
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: "Manuel J. Martinez" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], "Manuel J. Martinez" <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: speed

can someone out in FINALE tell me : why is it so slow in inserting a blank
measure (or measures) , I wish there was a way to speed that mass mover up!
Thanks! Jack


================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 22:01:07 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 1995 01:38:35 +0200
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (just another VKTM)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: 2 Questions

1) Can one put a Bartok pizz (snap) in Finale?

2) I'm doing a Debussy-style harp trio and need to notate the
tunings. The recent postings left me more than confused about
mixing fonts. And, not only am I concerned about getting "#'s "
to come out but I cannot get flats either. Any suggestions?

John

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 22:05:03 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: DS3 Chad Storey <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: List down?
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 95 18:02:12 HST

>
> Is the list down? Can someone write me direct if this
> gets posted?
>
> John Binkov
>
>

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 22:20:16 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: DS3 Chad Storey <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: How unsubscribe this list?
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 95 18:17:21 HST

>
> I've lost the original file that included how to unsubscribe this list.
> Until I get my AOL software problems fixed, I need to do this. Will someone
> please let me know how? Thanks.
>
> --Tyler Tex
>
I think it's just

UNSUBSCRIBE Finale Tyler [email protected]

By the way, My grandparents have a lakehouse in Hide-Away! :-}
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 22:53:23 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 12:57:46 -0500 (EST)
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Overture
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Help!
I am a frequent Finale user here at the office who is looking to go ahead and
buy a copy to use at home. I have also heard superficial good reviews on
Overture. Would some of you on the list who are at least somewhat familiar
with both Overture and Finale please be so kind as to post your personal
comparative reviews.

Thank you in advance!

Dennis Taylor
Shepherd College
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 23:47:21 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 00:48:08 -0500
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (David Froom)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: 2 Questions

>1) Can one put a Bartok pizz (snap) in Finale?
>
>2) I'm doing a Debussy-style harp trio and need to notate the
>tunings. The recent postings left me more than confused about
>mixing fonts. And, not only am I concerned about getting "#'s "
>to come out but I cannot get flats either. Any suggestions?
>
>John

Make the Bartok pizz in shape designer. An "o" with a little line dragged
into place (do at 400% for accuracy in the design). Once created, it can
be used repeatedly.

After struggling with the provided harp tuning shape (that most decidedly
doesn't work as the manual says it does -- at least the last time I tried
it, which was in 2.6.3) I've used a harp tuning system for my own sanity
that I adopted from a friend who writes a lot of orchestra music. Use the
text block tool (which allows changing fonts). Use Petrucci 12 point for
sharps and flats. Layout the tunings with letters (times 12 pt bold) for
note names, for example:

D C B / E F G# A

To be sure, ask a harpist how they would take to this. I've not had any
complaints; but I always check with the player first.

If you would rather use the standard system, I really think the easiest
thing to do would be to draw them in by hand (rapidograph pen and a good
ruler). Both fast and accurate.

If Finale has fixed the harp shape (post 2.6.3 -- I've not checked this in
any of the 3.x versions) then try it as the manual suggests.

David Froom - [email protected]
Music Department
St. Mary's College of Maryland
St. Mary's City, Maryland

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 00:11:26 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 23:11:46 -0700 (MST)
From: Mark Basinski - UA School of Music <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: 2 Questions
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

>1) Can one put a Bartok pizz (snap) in Finale?

I was just admiring the bartok pizz symbol I saw in a sample of the Casady &
Greene "Gracenotes & Crescendo" music fonts, and grumping that Petrucci lacks
this, but realized that one should be able to create that symbol very quickly
via the shape designer. just a circle and a short line. If you haven't learned
how to use the shape designer, do make the effort, as it is one of the best new
features of version 3

>2) I'm doing a Debussy-style harp trio and need to notate the
>tunings. The recent postings left me more than confused about
>mixing fonts. And, not only am I concerned about getting "#'s "
>to come out but I cannot get flats either. Any suggestions?

It's not clear what you are trying to do here (or how?) - indicating the tuning
of the harps as a text block or what? I might use the text block and add the
accidentals by hand, depends on what exactly you want it to look like. You
could just have an ossia measure (floating kind) to indicate the tunings on a
staff.

Mark Basinski University of Arizona
Adjunct Assistant Professor School of Music

[email protected] (602) 621-7470

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 00:13:11 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 1995 10:29:46 -0600
From: [email protected] (Philip Nelson)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Windows Finale to Mac Finale file compatibility...
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <v01510100ab52bfd3d83c@[143.200.129.21]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

The problems you mention have to do with MAC/PC not Finale. Inadditon to
using Apple File Exchange you could get PC Exchange (came with my Power
Mac) or Access PC so your mac can read PC disks assuming you have an FDHD
drive.

Philip Nelson
Network Specialist
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 01:33:23 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Return-Path: <yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il>
From: Yuval Shay-El <yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <9501310733.AA01360@cyclone.tau.ac.il>
Subject: Re: 2 Questions
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 09:33:36 +0200 (IST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
> 1) Can one put a Bartok pizz (snap) in Finale?
>
I used the shape designer to create it, by combining the o font with
a small vertical line, then using it as an expression mark.

--
Yuval Shay-El
Department of Geophysics | Home address:
and Planetary Sciences | 19 Granados
Tel-Aviv University | Ramat Gan, 52326
Tel-Aviv 69978 | Israel
Israel |
Fax: 972-3-6409282 | Tel: 972-3-5741634
Tel: 972-3-6409120 |
e-mail: yuval@cyclone.tau.ac.il

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 02:12:08 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 03:09:42 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Rameau font

Would love to see a picture of your figured bass
work around in Finale..

Thanks Ben
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 02:42:22 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 09:42:38 +0100
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: terje.[email protected] (Terje Winther)
Reply-To: [email protected], terje.[email protected]
Subject: Re: 2 Questions

>1) Can one put a Bartok pizz (snap) in Finale?

Yes, but you have to create it yourself (at least I had to do).
Create it in staff expression, and add the MIDI-specs to how it should be
performed by Finale.
Remember to un-check the "Dragging horizontal" button (or whatever the
exact name of the box is).

(: tw.

Terje Winther
Komponist/Produksjonskonsulent Composer/Producer
Ny Musikk I.S.C.M. (Norwegian section of the
International Society for Contemporary Music
Ny Musikks Komponistgruppe (NMK) New Music Composers' Group
E-mail: [email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 03:42:26 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 03:43:12 -0600 (CST)
From: Barry Ursaki <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: FinWin 3.0.1 updater
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I just checked the Usenet again looking for the FinWin 3.0.1 updater.
Only parts (1/3) & (2/3) show up because I tried to get (3/3) the other
night and now no longer have access to it. Could someone please re-post
(3/3) so I can download the whole file at once. My server won't accept
partial UUencoded files.

Sorry for all the bother.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Barry Ursaki |-_ + Good musicians execute their music. |
| Saskatoon, SK | -_ + |
| Canada. /\| | + Bad ones murder it! |
| \/ | + |
| <[email protected]> | + |
| or /\| + Hug a Musician... |
| <[email protected]> \/ + they never get to dance. |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 05:49:33 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 06:52:10 -0500 (EST)
From: "Meredith M. Williams" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Finale for Windows 3.0.2 updater
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Okay, I don't know why the updater never appeared at WINFTP.CICA.INDIANA.EDU.
So, this time I uploaded it to wuarchive.wustl.edu. It's called fin302.exe
and it's in /pub/MSDOS_UPLOADS/music. I will also repost it to
alt.binaries.sounds.utilities. If this doesn't work, perhaps I can email it
to someone who can upload it properly.
Meredith
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 07:19:04 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 06:19:53 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Lyrics and how to beat them
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Sun, 29 Jan 1995, Kevin Moore wrote:

> In case Coda is listening, all you have to do in Mosaic to get a word
> extension is type "_" after the word-it always lines up perfectly

Just for my curiosity, how long does the extension go for? Is it smart
enough to find the next note with a syllable and stop there? Does it
break and continue after a system break?

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 08:32:17 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 08:31:22 -0600
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale MIDI: OS/2

The documentation for 3.0 and for 3.0.1 (more on that later) states
that OS/2 is not supported. You can run Finale, but you will have no
MIDI support. Coda's position is that you are on your own.
Lance Philip Strugar
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 08:34:18 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab53f85c05021004c1d9@[158.135.73.248]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 08:35:08 -0600
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Henry Howey)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: speed

Manuel Martinez writes:
>can someone out in FINALE tell me : why is it so slow in inserting a blank
>measure (or measures) , I wish there was a way to speed that mass mover up!

FINALE is a relational database with various aspects of the music brought
to the fore by means of the tool palette. The Mass Mover is the most
powerful tool capable of accessing the functions of several of the other
tools. The real data for the file is obtained from the "Enigma" files
which are temporary files running in the background. Each time a function
is required, FINALE must access the data(Engima) files. If these are held
anywhere but on a RamDisk, the speed becomes a function of processor speed
plus disk access speed.

I have obtained a maximum of speed by the following process:
1. Fast processor (68040)
2. 20 megs RAM
3. RamDoubler plus Maxima RamDisk (from Connectix)
4. Finale set at 2X normal settings
5. Monitor set to B&W

Until a native PowerMac version is released, this is the best i can do.



Henry Howey
Professor
Department of Music
Sam Houston State University
Huntsville, TX 77341
[email protected]
FAX (409) 294-3765
W (409) 294-1364
H (409) 291-0626
Owner of FINALE Discussion List





================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 09:17:31 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
From: Martin J van den Boogaard <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: Finale 3.0.2
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 16:17:51 +0100 (GMT+0100)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Dear Meredith,

Thanks for the Finale 3.0.2 posting. It uuencodes fine (if,
indeed, you save all the files straight away when they pass by on
newsnet and concatenate then as soon as you have all three of them)
and runs ok. Nice to finally have real PostScript ties! Thanks
again for your help.

Yours,

Martin J van den Boogaard | [email protected]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Dept of Atomic & Interface Physics | the Netherlands
Debye Institute--Universiteit Utrecht | phone +31-30-533 159
PO Box 80.000 | fax +31-30-543 165
NL-3508 TA Utrecht | http://www.fys.ruu.nl/~boogaard
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
`...all these songs are mine if you expresse them well,
otherwise they are your owne.' -- Thomas Campion
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 10:32:39 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 95 08:27:52 pst
From: "Blake Hodgetts" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re[2]: speed

Manuel Martinez writes:
>can someone out in FINALE tell me : why is it so slow in inserting a blank
>measure (or measures) , I wish there was a way to speed that mass mover up!

>FINALE is a relational database with various aspects of the music brought
>to the fore by means of the tool palette. The Mass Mover is the most
>powerful tool capable of accessing the functions of several of the other
>tools. The real data for the file is obtained from the "Enigma" files
>which are temporary files running in the background. Each time a function
>is required, FINALE must access the data(Engima) files. If these are held
>anywhere but on a RamDisk, the speed becomes a function of processor speed
>plus disk access speed.

>I have obtained a maximum of speed by the following process:
>1. Fast processor (68040)
>2. 20 megs RAM
>3. RamDoubler plus Maxima RamDisk (from Connectix)
>4. Finale set at 2X normal settings
>5. Monitor set to B&W

>Until a native PowerMac version is released, this is the best i can do.

If you have 20MB of RAM, you probably don't need RAMDoubler, and this can
actually slow you down. I run Finale with the application and temp files in a
12MB RAM Disk, which with 20MB of RAM onboard leaves me plenty of room for
System software.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Blake Hodgetts / "Life is the only *
Musician / thing we have * [email protected]
Eugene, Oregon / worth living" *
Opinions represented above are mine, not my employer's
-----------------------------------------------------------

The following is an attached File item from cc:Mail. It contains
information that had to be encoded to ensure successful transmission
through various mail systems. To decode the file use the UUDECODE
program.
--------------------------------- Cut Here ---------------------------------
begin 644 rfc822.txt
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M52YE9'4L($U54U](14A`4TA352Y%1%4-"E-U8FIE8W0Z(%)E.B!S<&5E9`T*

end

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 10:47:45 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: 31 Jan 95 11:45:34 EST
From: Thom Gandet <73734.3463@compuserve.com>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Finale Discussion <[email protected]>
Subject: Finale 3.0.4 (update) on CIS
Message-ID: <950131164533_73734.3463_CHL96-1@CompuServe.COM>

Coda has posted an update to Finale for Windows on the MIDIBVEN CompuServe
Forum. Files to update Finale 3.0 > 3.0.4 and Finale 3.0.2 > 3.0.4 are
available there. Are the Finale updates posted on CIS also available by
anonymous FTP?

Here's a copy of Coda's file from CIS describing the differences between 3.0.2
and 3.0.2:
------------------------
Differences between Finale 3.0.4 and Finale 3.0.2

Finale 3.0.4 contains some additional corrections and enhancements to Finale
3.0.2.
NOTE: Finale 3.0.3 was a German release. It was not released to customers in the
USA.

-- You can now control the maximum space between multiple hyphens for lyrics
with the new "Space Between Hyphens" setting in the Notation Options dialog box.
When the distance between hyphens matches this value, Finale creates another
hyphen between the lyric syllables. The Notation Options dialog box was
rearranged to accommodate this new feature.

-- A new key wrapping option during proportional key changes appears in the Key
Signature dialog box. The new "Wrap Keys If Necessary" checkbox is only
available when "Transpose All Keys Proportionally" is checked. The new option
defaults to checked when available. The setting is remembered during the
session, but is not saved with the file. When checked, this setting prevents
keys with double sharps and flats such as A sharp major (10 sharps) occurring
during proportional key changes. By default you'll get B flat, instead of A
sharp.

-- A new "Simplify Key" checkbox appears in the Staff Transpositions dialog box.
It is checked by default in older files, and is saved with the file for each
staff. If checked, Finale examines the key produced by a transposition and
determines if an enharmonic spelling would result in fewer sharps or flats. For
example, a passage in B major for B flat trumpet, when unchecked, would be
notated in C sharp major (7 sharps). When checked, it would end up in D flat
instead (5 flats).

-- A new FINALE.INI value of 2 for IncludeFonts in the [Settings] section,
allows Finale to compile PostScript listings on systems that have no soft font
listing in the WIN.INI file. See "IncludeFonts" in the "About the FINALE.INI"
section, below.

-- If non-numeric or negative values are entered for Root or Alternate Bass in
the Chord Definition dialog box the edit control will be set to 1, not 32.

-- Fixed placement of chords displayed over an alternate bass for chord suffixes
that contain characters with a negative vertical position.

-- Mid-measure clefs now appear in regions set to rhythmic notation.

-- Included more improvements for placement of mid-measure clefs on reduced
staves.

-- The Key Signature dialog box now provides visual feedback when you drag the
thumb to change keys.

-- Optimized the speed of key changes made with the Key Signature Tool.
-- Newly converted Finale 2 files now appear correctly if Special Tools' Custom
Stem Tool was used to hide stems on notes (by selecting an "empty" shape). To
correct files converted with Finale 3.0 or Finale 3.0.2, edit the "empty" shape
and change the rectangle's line width to zero.

-- Improved Remove Deleted Items option in the Data Check to prevent hanging on
corrupt files.

-- Fixed the Set Font button for Music in the Select Default Fonts dialog box.

-- The progress bar for large edits now reflects the actual percentage
completed.
-------------------------------------------------


Regards,
Thom Gandet

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 10:49:59 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <ab541a5e000210045a8c@[158.135.73.248]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 10:50:52 -0600
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Henry Howey)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re[2]: speed

Blake Hodgetts writes:

>If you have 20MB of RAM, you probably don't need RAMDoubler, and this can
>actually slow you down. I run Finale with the application and temp files in a
>12MB RAM Disk, which with 20MB of RAM onboard leaves me plenty of room for
>System software.

The beauty of RamDoubler AND Maxima, is that they work together to create a
RamDisk that is TWICE the normal size. There is no loss of speed.
Connectix is the primo company for such extensions/control panels.



Henry Howey
Professor
Department of Music
Sam Houston State University
Huntsville, TX 77341
[email protected]
FAX (409) 294-3765
W (409) 294-1364
H (409) 291-0626
Owner of FINALE Discussion List





================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 11:02:01 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 08:31:23 -0800
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Kevin Moore)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: re:incomplete digests

>I'm still receiving Finale-digests with less postings than are listed
>in the table of contents.
>
>---
> Mike Ossmann

Me too.

[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 11:05:48 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 17:07:41 +0000
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Debbie Metrustry)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Powerbook

Hi all,
I've been away from the list for a while and since I came back a day or two
ago it all seems very quiet. I hope it's still extant.

Anyway, I have a query re powerbooks. How do you enter rests and delete
notes from a chord (without MIDI) in Speedy Entry on a keyboard that
doesn't have a clear (num lock) key?

Thanks,

Debbie.
--------------------
Debbie Metrustry
Top Type Music Bureau, Dublin &
Trinity College, Dublin
Tel&Fax:+353-1-6261409
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 11:09:07 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 09:09:45 -0800 (PST)
From: Alan Chapman <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Rameau font
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <Pine.3.87.9501310945.A27914-0100000@cougar>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


On Tue, 31 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:

> Would love to see a picture of your figured bass
> work around in Finale..
>
> Thanks Ben
>

I'll gladly send you some samples. Just e-mail your postal address.

Alan

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 11:39:48 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
From: "Arie Weeren" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Date: 31 Jan 95 18:39:40 MET
Subject: Am I still on ?

Hello everybody,

Is everything quiet on this list or is something wrong ? I have not
received anything from this list in the past two weeks. Please excuse
me for sending this message to the whole list, but I did not know
where else to send it to.

Arie Weeren.




+----------------------------+---------------------------+
| Ir. A.J.T.M. Weeren | Phone : (+31)(0)13-662660 |
| Tilburg University | Fax : (+31)(0)13-663280 |
| Department of Econometrics | E-Mail: |
| P.O. Box 90153 | [email protected] |
| 5000 LE Tilburg | |
+----------------------------+---------------------------+

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 11:51:19 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, Jan 31, 1995 11:52 AM
From: Alice Brin Renken <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Powerbook
To: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], Alice Brin Renken <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

In message Debbie Metrustry writes:
> Hi all,
> I've been away from the list for a while and since I came back a day or two
> ago it all seems very quiet. I hope it's still extant.
>
> Anyway, I have a query re powerbooks. How do you enter rests and delete
> notes from a chord (without MIDI) in Speedy Entry on a keyboard that
> doesn't have a clear (num lock) key?

Dear Debbie, Rests without a numeric keypad are quite simple. Enter your value,
then hit shift and delete together. I also use this on extended keyboards
because the 10-key pad is too far away. I think this addition came with one of
the first upgrades I got (I started with 2.6.3) on a loose sheet of paper. Good
luck!


@
||
||
Alice Renken ||
( )
"Look, Ma, no end-pin!" ><
<( )>
_\ /_
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 12:11:31 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 13:12:11 -0500 (EST)
From: "STEPHANIE W. WILSON" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Henry Howey <[email protected]>
Subject: Need info
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950131130233.15795A-100000@hamlet>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I'm a graduate student in composition. So far, I'm using Finale only at
school, on a Mac. My husband and I are planning on getting a computer
(IBM-compatible) so I can do my work at home. Unfortunately, I'm not a
computer wizard, just an end-user. I need info for my computer wizard
husband.

An 800 number (for the software company) would be great, so I could get
him to call for information (preferably while I'm at school). Otherwise I
need to know:

*what is Finale made for, besides Mac and Windows
*Do you have to have Windows to use Finale?
*How much RAM do I need?
*What size hard drive?
*What (exactly) hardware do I need to be able to run Finale
quickly and efficiently?
*What kind of sound card do I need? (Or is that built in the computer?)

I guess basically I need all the info I can get. He's ready to buy
pretty soon, and as soon as we have a computer, I'm buying my own (at
last!) copy of Finale.

I know there is software out there that will allow you to cross platform
your files - I'll be doing homework on IBM and having composition lessons
on Mac. How big a problem will this be? Does anyone know of this
software I've mentioned? I need to know where to get it, I think it was
less than $50.

Thanks so much for your help.

My email address is

[email protected]

My snail address is

Stephanie Wilson
912 Piney Grove Road, Lot 25
Kernersville, NC 27284

Thanks again.

Stephanie
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 12:11:52 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, Jan 31, 1995 12:12 PM
From: Alice Brin Renken <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: MAC upgrades & bugs
To: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], Alice Brin Renken <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

In message Charles Nagel writes:
> I've noticed that there have been a number of questions posted to this
> list regarding assorted bugs with printing and other functions of Finale
> and Mac; and that an apparently significant number of these indicate that
> the users have upgraded to MAC system 7.5. I'm wondering if it's not such
> a good idea to"upgrade" my Mac's system 7.1. The Fin.3.2.1 upgrade is
> slouching toward my computer via snail mail; would that make a difference?
> (peripheral comment: if anyone is wondering about the effect of last
> night's earthquake in Seattle, it screwed up the phone system for a few
> hours, but as far as I can tell the U. of W.'s computer system, etc.,
> survived; had to spend a few minutes striaghtening the paintings on the
> walls.)
> thanks

I've had no trouble printing out (HP LaserJet 4 MP) under system 7.5, smart
shapes and all, since I removed QuickDraw GX and reinstalled my old PostScript
fonts. I, too, am waiting for the 3.2.1 upgrade, but it's mostly because I like
to keep current, not because I'm desperate.

@
|| [email protected]
|| Alice Brin Renken
Alice Renken || Music Department
( ) Carleton College
"Look, Ma, no end-pin!" >< Northfield, MN 55057
<( )>
_\ /_

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 12:39:03 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 13:39:48 -0500 (EST)
From: "STEPHANIE W. WILSON" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: Henry Howey <[email protected]>
Subject: up-to-date?
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950131133907.15795C-100000@hamlet>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

What's the most current version of Finale for IBM-compatible?

Stephanie
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 13:18:21 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Return-Path: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 13:56:00 -0500
From: [email protected] (John M. Graham)
To: [email protected]
Subject: Prices
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected] (John M. Graham)

The Case Western Reserve University bookstore in Cleveland has
both Mac and IBM Finale for $190. This is the lowest price I've
ever seen. I don't know if they will sell to non-CWRU students,
or through the mail, though. Their number is (216) 368-2650.

-John

--
_______/| John M. Graham / The Cleveland Institute of Music ._o
(___|___\|____ [email protected] / //\.
._|_|_____) ******** \>> |
brought to you by the letters j, m, and g, and the number 14. \\
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 13:25:55 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 13:26:13 -0600
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Need info

Dear Stephanie;
Regarding MAC - PC - MAC transfers, Philip Nelson writes:

> The problems you mention have to do with MAC/PC not Finale. Inadditon to
> using Apple File Exchange you could get PC Exchange (came with my Power
> Mac) or Access PC so your mac can read PC disks assuming you have an FDHD
> drive.

As to your PC questions;
> *what is Finale made for, besides Mac and Windows
Power PC. This is fairly new, but some have reported success.

> *Do you have to have Windows to use Finale?
Yes. Windows 3.0 or above. Windows for Workgroups 3.11 is better.

> *How much RAM do I need?
You can get by with 4 Meg if you like Adagio. As a general rule,
never have less than 8 Meg for Windows. The less RAM you possess,
the more the system must virtualize or "simulate" that RAM on your
hard disk, and thus, the slower your system operates.

> *What size hard drive?
You can get by with 200 Meg, but at $.50 a Meg or less, you should
try for 500 Meg or more.

> *What (exactly) hardware do I need to be able to run Finale
> quickly and efficiently?
Since you indicated that you already have a PC, I assume you mean
synth hardware. You really don't need any kind of MIDI device, but
life is much easier with a good controller (keyboard) and sound module.
If you're on a budget, you can find the two combined in a simple MIDI
compatible 4 or 5 octave keyboard. These are frequently available on
the used market.
Most any printer which can be used for other Windows applications will
work on Finale. PostScript printers work the best (according to Coda),
but are also quite expensive.

> *What kind of sound card do I need? (Or is that built in the computer?)
It isn't built into the computer. Finale for Windows supports SoundBlaster.
This gives you audio output that can be played through your home sound
system. You also get MIDI capabilities. If you want only MIDI (your
keyboard produces the sounds itself), a MIDI interface card will do the
job. Finale operates very well with an MPU-401 MIDI card. The MPU-401
designates a protocol, and several manufacturers produce cards that
follow that protocol.

Feel free to send personal messages if you need more help. I don't mind.

Lance Philip Strugar
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 13:38:29 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 13:33:11 -0600
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: up-to-date?

> What's the most current version of Finale for IBM-compatible?
Finale for Windows version 3.0.1 is the current release, but you may not
be able to get it from a distributer. Version 3.0 is widely available.
The 3.0.1 can be obtained through CompuServe, MIDI B forum, in the library
section. Coda intends to post the update officially, but you may be able
to obtain it from an FTP site. Actually, 3.0 is pretty good. I has a few
bugs. Don't we all.
Lance philip

Lance Philip Strugar

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 13:42:56 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 95 11:43 PST
To: [email protected]
From: Craig Marks <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Digest?

I've seen postings regarding a digest of this list. How do I subscribe
to that instead of the daily list? My mailbox is being overwhelmed.
Thanks. Craig
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 15:21:51 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 16:24:12 -0500 (EST)
From: "Meredith M. Williams" <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale 3.0.4 (update) on CIS
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Sigh.... Now that Finale 3.0.2 has been uploaded to wuarchive.wustl.edu, and
reposted to alt.binaries.sounds.utilities, there's Finale 3.0.4.....

Who will be kind enough to make it available to the huddled internet masses?

Meredith
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 15:41:24 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 16:39:00 -0500
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Overture

>>I am a frequent Finale user here at the office who is looking to go ahead
and buy a copy to use at home. I have also heard superficial good reviews on
Overture.Would some of you on the list who are at least somewhat familiar
with both Overture and Finale please be so kind as to post your personal
comparative reviews.

Thank you in advance!

Dennis Taylor
Shepherd College<<

I think the key here is that you're already knowledgable about Finale. So I
would reccomend staying with it. As far as Overture is concerned, it's a good
product with a lot of nice features but I found it difficult to get around,
mostly because my brain is all tied up with Finale.

Tom
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 17:05:46 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Font trouble

Hello all. I just received my copy of GoldenAge for WinFin 3 (incredible
font!). I tried to change the font for time signatures (under "notation" in
the Select Defualt Fonts dialog) and *none* of the items could be changed -
the "Set Font.." button doesn't appear to work. Is this a known bug?

Thanks

=======================================================
Dan Galbraith <> <> [email protected] <> <> Overland Park, KS
<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>
"Through the modem, off the gateway, around the router... nothing but net!"
=======================================================

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 17:22:45 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 95 15:23 PST
From: [email protected] (Russell G. Almond)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected].
Subject: Creating Postscript Music archives (font issues)

I would like to create an ftp/http-able archive of some music I've
been writing. In order to reach the widest possible audience I would
like to post postscript version which they can download. Inevitably,
this would mean including Petrucci or some other music font. Ideally,
I would like to leave the font as a separate file, because this would
save considerably on space. (As my music is rather short, the savings
can be as much as twofold.)

Technically, this is quite feasible. I already do it for personal
use. I upload the Petrucci font and the postscript music file
separately. Whenever I want to print music, I just cat the font and
the music together before sending it to the printer.

However, if I implement this scheme for an archive, I have a further
problem. The Petrucci font (which I'm currently using) is the
property of CODA, and giving away free copies to everybody in the
world probably exceeds my licence to use it.

I have two questions:

1) What is CODA's policy on distributing the Petrucci font with
postscript music produced by Finale?

2) Does anybody know of any good public domain fonts for music
publishing which I could distribute through an archive? I'm
especially interested in fonts which would have the look of early
printed music (e.g., Attaginant and Susato).

My appologies if I am stirring the embers on old issues, but I looked
through the archives and couldn't find the answers.

--Russell Almond
[email protected]
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 19:08:34 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 19:09:08 -0500 (CDT)
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Finale vs. Musicator GS for Windows
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

I have been using Musicator GS for Windows for about two years. I am now
taking a course that requires Finale. While I am interested in learning about
Finale, I am wondering what the advantages and disadvantages are between the
two programs.

Thanks in advance

josh wirtz
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 19:20:01 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 17:20:44 -0800 (PST)
From: James Pelley <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Finale 3.04 patcher
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

The patcher to update Finale/Windows 3.02 to 3.04 is available by FTP
from wuarchive.wustl.edu in the directory /pub/MSDOS_UPLOADS/music.

The file name is f302_304.exe, 826711 bytes. The accompanying text file,
f304wu.txt, describes the new features and bug fixes, and is essentially
the same as the information posted to this list earlier today by Thom Gandet.

There is also a patcher available from CODA for updating Finale 3.0 to
3.04. I leave it to some other person to upload it to a public site; it
would take me 20 minute$ to get it off of Compu$erve. :-)

Both of these patch files are available free from CODA; call their
customer service number.

f302_304.exe is a self-extracting archive. I would suggest running it in
a temporary directory, then copying the files to your FINALE3 directory.

Enjoy-

Jim Pelley

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 19:40:00 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected] (Andrian Pervazov)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: up-to-date?
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 20:40:45 -0500 (EST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Coda just released version 3.0.4 - the patche is available on Compuserve.
(They don't care about the Internet, in fact, they probably don't even
know it exists :-). May some kind soul upload it to a ftp site.

The previous version is 3.0.2. I got it free of charge from Coda after
sending them email. It's already available for downloading from the
internet - I think someone posted it to one of the newsgroups and also
uploaded it somewhere, can't remember exactly - go search the digest via
gopher or www and you'll get the data.

Andrian

--
Andrian Pervazov
Music Department, University of Pennsylvania
Internet: [email protected] Phone: 215-732-2053
Postscript scores at ftp://ftp.gmd.de/music/scores/pervazov
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 19:40:16 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 15:39:20 -0700 (PDT)
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: up-to-date?
To: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

I recently received Finale for Windows upgrade disks fro Coda and they
are labeled as 3.0.2

Frank Traficante
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 20:06:00 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 18:06:43 -0800 (PST)
From: LAMONT DOWNS <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Font trouble
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


On Tue, 31 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:

> Hello all. I just received my copy of GoldenAge for WinFin 3 (incredible
> font!). I tried to change the font for time signatures (under "notation" in
> the Select Defualt Fonts dialog) and *none* of the items could be changed -
> the "Set Font.." button doesn't appear to work. Is this a known bug?
>

Yup! Presumably the 3.0.4 update posted today will fix this, but I
haven't had time to try it myself. Any reports from (I hope) happy
upgraders? At least, Coda's file describing the update _says_ it's
fixed.

Lamont Downs
[email protected]
================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 21:05:08 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 21:01:49 -0600 (CST)
From: Dorothy Kaye Keyser <dkeyser@jove.acs.unt.edu>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: All recipients <[email protected]>
Subject: Hyphens in lyrics
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950131205625.25146A-100000@jove.acs.unt.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Is there a way to control the hyphens in lyrics? I want to 1) put the
hyphens next to the preceding syllable instead of midway between two
syllables (i.e. com- mu- ni- cate instead of com - mu - ni - cate) and
2) sprinkle hyphens under long melismas instead of using word
extensions. Help!

Dorothy Keyser Medievalist
College of Music, University of North Texas
email: dkeyser@jove.acs.unt.edu
<<A paradox is just the truth standing on its head to get attention.>>

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 21:05:51 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 19:03:08 -0800
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (Brian C. Lovrin)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Finale vs. Musicator GS for Windows

>I have been using Musicator GS for Windows for about two years. I am now
>taking a course that requires Finale. While I am interested in learning about
>Finale, I am wondering what the advantages and disadvantages are between the
>two programs.
>
>Thanks in advance
>
> josh wirtz
>
>

I have used Musicator for laying down tracks real-time. I feel Finale is
really lacking in this area.

Namely, the selection of instruments pales in comparison with Musicator.
Instead of seeing a list (and hearing the sound!), you're req'd to input a
midi #.

But you can't beat Finale when it comes to layout. Not once have I said:
"Oh, I wish Finale could let me change this." I mean, if you want it to
look a certain way, you can do it. Simple as that. And that's what
important for publication.

However, the music has to be heard before it can be published.

Oh, I wish Finale could have a pick-list of the instruments...

Hoping this was coherent,

=> Brian

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 22:03:25 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 21:04:13 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Hyphens in lyrics
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Tue, 31 Jan 1995, Dorothy Kaye Keyser wrote:

> Is there a way to control the hyphens in lyrics? I want to

As with many of the posts on this list you fail to tell us what version
and platform. I will answer for Mac and assume that if you are using
Windows that the process is similar

>1) put the
> hyphens next to the preceding syllable instead of midway between two
> syllables (i.e. com- mu- ni- cate instead of com - mu - ni - cate) and

An option-hypen produces a non-breaking hyphen which will stick to the
other characters in the syllable. I find this useful for syllables which
are the last part of a work but which lead off a new system as well as
the use which you mention.

2) sprinkle hyphens under long melismas instead of using word
> extensions.

I am assumming you mean between syllables of the same word. In this case
different templates were distributed with version 3.03 for Mac which
accomplished this. With version 3.2.1 (I believe) came the Space Between
Hyphens option which accomplishes what you want. A post earlier today
listed the Windows 3.04 version features and this is listed as one of
them. If you have an existing Mac 3.0 file which you want to change it is
possible but the explanation is too involved to clutter up the list. If
you need this I can help but write directly to me.

*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 22:14:21 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 21:15:05 -0700 (MST)
From: WORSTER LAWRENCE EDWARD <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: 2 Questions
Message-ID: <Pine.[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

John Binkov

> 2) I'm doing a Debussy-style harp trio and need to notate the
> tunings. The recent postings left me more than confused about
> mixing fonts. And, not only am I concerned about getting "#'s "
> to come out but I cannot get flats either. Any suggestions?

Create the expressions in the shape designer of the Text expression tool.
You may create them as one text block or several. The allignment of text
blocks is superior in this tool because of the ability to work in 800%
enlargement. Some people use the chord tool but I don't prefer this method.
The sharps problem in the header tool has been answered a dozen times in
the last week. To get # signs to print enter two (C## = C#)
*******************************
* Larry Worster *
* The Full Measure *
* Boulder, CO 80303 *
* (303) 494-3159 *
* [email protected] *
*******************************

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 22:22:32 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <v02110100ab54a95a854c@[140.174.229.213]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 20:19:16 -0700
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected] (David Scribner)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Creating Postscript Music archives (font issues)
CC: [email protected]

>I would like to create an ftp/http-able archive of some music I've
>been writing. In order to reach the widest possible audience I would
>like to post postscript version which they can download. Inevitably,
>this would mean including Petrucci or some other music font. Ideally,
>I would like to leave the font as a separate file, because this would
>save considerably on space. (As my music is rather short, the savings
>can be as much as twofold.)
>
>Technically, this is quite feasible. I already do it for personal
>use. I upload the Petrucci font and the postscript music file
>separately. Whenever I want to print music, I just cat the font and
>the music together before sending it to the printer.
>
>However, if I implement this scheme for an archive, I have a further
>problem. The Petrucci font (which I'm currently using) is the
>property of CODA, and giving away free copies to everybody in the
>world probably exceeds my licence to use it.
>
>I have two questions:
>
>1) What is CODA's policy on distributing the Petrucci font with
>postscript music produced by Finale?
>
>2) Does anybody know of any good public domain fonts for music
>publishing which I could distribute through an archive? I'm
>especially interested in fonts which would have the look of early
>printed music (e.g., Attaginant and Susato).
>
>My appologies if I am stirring the embers on old issues, but I looked
>through the archives and couldn't find the answers.
>
> --Russell Almond
> [email protected]

Although I am not sure that it will work with FINALE, you might try using
Adobe Acrobat to create a file to upload. Acrobat will embed the font
within the document so there is not a problem of having to upload the font
seperately but there still may be a question as to the distribution of the
font. I use Acrobat with newsletters that are produced in PageMaker that I
upload for ftping. In order to view or print the document you need to
get a reader that can be downloaded from many sites and Acrobat documents
can be read on all platforms, ie: Dos, Windows, Mac and Unix.

This is just a suggestion but it seems to be the way of the future. I just
read that the IRS has published all of the tax forms on the net by this
method. One nice feature is that by using the security password feature,
someone downloading the file can view it and even print it out if you allow
it but cannot make any changes to it.

If you have any questions feel free to e-mail me.

David Scribner
Black Iris Publishing
[email protected]

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 22:38:32 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 23:39:21 -0500
To: [email protected], [email protected]
From: [email protected] (David Froom)
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Hyphens in lyrics

>Is there a way to control the hyphens in lyrics? I want to 1) put the
>hyphens next to the preceding syllable instead of midway between two
>syllables (i.e. com- mu- ni- cate instead of com - mu - ni - cate) and
>2) sprinkle hyphens under long melismas instead of using word
>extensions. Help!
>
>Dorothy Keyser Medievalist
>College of Music, University of North Texas
>email: dkeyser@jove.acs.unt.edu
><<A paradox is just the truth standing on its head to get attention.>>

In addition to Larry's excellent suggestion, you might try it the
"cheating" way. Don't put in any hyphens at all with the lyric tool. Put
them in as note expressions, and they can be positioned any way you like.
(Actually, I believe that Larry's suggestion results in a slightly longer
than usual hyphen?)

David Froom - [email protected]
Music Department
St. Mary's College of Maryland
St. Mary's City, Maryland

================================================================================
Archive-Date: Tue, 31 Jan 1995 23:56:39 CDT
Sender: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: [email protected]
From: [email protected]
Reply-To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Font trouble

>
>
>On Tue, 31 Jan 1995 [email protected] wrote:
>
>> Hello all. I just received my copy of GoldenAge for WinFin 3 (incredible
>> font!). I tried to change the font for time signatures (under "notation" in
>> the Select Defualt Fonts dialog) and *none* of the items could be changed -
>> the "Set Font.." button doesn't appear to work. Is this a known bug?
>>
>
>Yup! Presumably the 3.0.4 update posted today will fix this, but I
>haven't had time to try it myself. Any reports from (I hope) happy
>upgraders? At least, Coda's file describing the update _says_ it's
>fixed.

I just downloaded the patch from the FTP archive listed in an earlier post
(wuarchive.wustl.edu in the directory /pub/MSDOS_UPLOADS/music for those who
didn't notice it). Sure enough, the Set Font button in question works fine.

=======================================================
Dan Galbraith <> <> [email protected] <> <> Overland Park, KS
<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>
"Through the modem, off the gateway, around the router... nothing but net!"
=======================================================

.
 
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